Let me get this straight...

Wow. Killerwave... Too much to respond to. I've said enough, and I don't feel like sorting through your post because I'm lazy, but like I said so many times before, if Everything Origin said was true, not only would there be more Wing Commander games than there are, but Blair and Maniac have met for the first time three times.

They contradict themselves constantly.

And yes, I am sure that it wasn't designed to be a Wing Commander game. That seems to be the only thing about the Darkening that fellow CICers and I agree about. (Besides the fact that it's a kickass game.)
 
Originally posted by LividLiquid
Wow. Killerwave... Too much to respond to. I've said enough, and I don't feel like sorting through your post because I'm lazy

Thank god! I didnt wanted to go through all that again too :D

Originally posted by LividLiquid
but like I said so many times before, if Everything Origin said was true, not only would there be more Wing Commander games than there are, but Blair and Maniac have met for the first time three times.
They contradict themselves constantly.

Not every word Origin say is true, but in that case thats not a multiple choice question, false or true, it is or it isnt, and if Origin says it is, then it is. And i already explained that Blair and Maniac didnt meet three times for the first time, but im not in the mood of going back to it.

Originally posted by LividLiquid
And yes, I am sure that it wasn't designed to be a Wing Commander game. That seems to be the only thing about the Darkening that fellow CICers and I agree about. (Besides the fact that it's a kickass game.)

That i cant say you're wrong, but im almost certain you are. Think about it: if you're going to make a Privateer game, a hundred years after WCP, would you put tbolts in it? I certainly wouldnt.


[Edited by KillerWave on 02-10-2001 at 22:49]
 
Thanks for the welcome!

The concept of in-system jumps initially appeared in Secret Missions 2 -- because of its location, ships could 'mini-jump' between locations in Firekka. This ability also appears in Enigma, in Wing Commander 2...

The 'main' jump tunnels in Privateer 2 (the ones you are charged entrance to) are, in fact, the same as regular jump points in Wing Commander -- rather than be opened by individual jump drives, they are kept open by jump gates. The technology behind these gates first appears in the Wing Commander IV novel, where specialized ships can open jump points to allow non jump-capable fighters to use them.


I must reply to your counterpoints...

"Counterpoint: Origin says a lot of things that are full of crap."

This is not a point as you provide no solid evidence to back it up. I am well aqquanted with the authors of the FAQ in question, and have never known them to be "full of crap".

"Point: There are two or three as-of-yet UNSPECIFIED instances in The Darkening in which WC or the Confeds are mentioned."

There are far more than two or three, and they have been specifically unspecified. Run Privateer Two and examine the planet and ship databases. You will find that various ships are registered to fly in the Confederation, and that various planets are sources of various materials for the Confederation.

"Counterpoint: These were thrown in at the last minute to justify placing a "Privateer" monicer on the game."

This is incorrect -- the game was always a "Privateer" spinoff -- can you doubt this, based on the gameplay itself? The issue in question has always been the "2" in the title. I note that the game had gone gold before the "2" was added (in fact, it shipped almost immediately afterwards in England).

Counterpoint: The physics are different.

Wing Commander has physics? Actually, the non-physics of Wing Commander are emulated rather well in the B-Render engine -- the only difference is the effect of ships ramming eachother, which is surely caused by the electronic shields and *not* the actual physics of the universe (which are, of course, a universal constant).

Counterpoint: Everybody's british.

Then, by your logic, England is not part of the world.

Counterpoint: It wasn't designed to be a WC game.

This is the point you're trying to make, not a specific counterpoint.

Counterpoint: Chris roberts had nothing to do with it, though he was still at the focal-point of the Wing Commander franchise at the time. (If anybody says that that rules out Prophecy, I'm going to laugh at you.)

Not true, Chris Roberts had left Origin before Privateer 2 shipped -- further, Privateer 2 was developed in England, not in Austin -- by his brother Erin. Chris Roberts, although credited as executive producer, had nothing to do with the original Privateer, either... or Armada, or Academy -- or even Wing Commander II.

Counterpoint: The refferences made to WC are vague at best, and could far more easilly be chalked up to "Whatever" than "It's WC!"

Please back up this point.

Counterpoint: We're all big, fat nerds for arguing about this for so damned long. Not because arguing is stupid, but because if one looks over these posts in full, one will notice that the argument has turned into a game of "Repeat as neccesary"

Disagree, we were nerds before we started arguing about this, and we're fat for completely different reasons. (I note, however, that it is very difficult to take the high moral ground after attempting to argue ones point...)

"Actually, you can speak japanese, french, spanish, portuguese...and people will still think youre intelligent"

Not if you don't use punctuation.

(And, of course, we'll think you're an idiot for posting in Spanish at an English speaking board... not that bilinguality has anything to do with my initial comment. :)).

As for the far more interesting issue of Rangers and Concordias -- no, 40 Rangers were not produced... the 'CV' designation is for *all* carriers. It is not an accurate guage for how many ships are in service, since blocks are reserved for entire classes (the 70 series, for example, was reserved for the Vesuvius class, although only four have entered service to date).

We know of a whole *lot* of COncordia class ships that were produced -- twenty-five.
 
Originally posted by Bandit LOAF
"Actually, you can speak japanese, french, spanish, portuguese...and people will still think youre intelligent"

Not if you don't use punctuation.

(And, of course, we'll think you're an idiot for posting in Spanish at an English speaking board... not that bilinguality has anything to do with my initial comment.).

No hablas español? :D
My english rocks...not! Btw, i sayd speak, not write...:D

[Edited by KillerWave on 02-10-2001 at 23:07]
 
LOAF, if what you said about the Numbering is correct then how come the Vesuvius was CV-1 and the St. Helens was CV-2, or at least that is what the big white numbers said. And 25 Concordia's really, I never guessed there were than many, do you know how many rangers, confederations, bengals, or durangos were made as well, i am genuinily interested to find out. Just wondering but where did that 25 number come from, was it in Fleet Action, which BTW I just got along with FF and ER, but I am going to read them in cronological order so I have not had the chance to read it yet.
 
No killer the Vesuvius was CV-1 and St. Helens was CV-2 it was just that there was a bug that sometimes showed the Vesuvius with a 2 on it
 
Oh, ok then. I knew there was some problem in that, since the Vesuvius was already finished, and the St. Helens not quite yet...:)
 
No, the Vesuvius and St. Helens weren't CV-1 and 2... those were experimental designations, similar to the CVX-1 assigned the Midway. According to the Wing Commander IV novel, they would have been assigned CV-70 and CV-71 respectively.

I gained the number 25 by counting the Concordia class carriers in the official ships list :). There may be many more, although I doubt the number is particularly higher. We know of only two Rangers, two Confederations, 9 Bengals and three Durangos.

KillerWave: You can't speak at the chat zone. (No, I don't habla español... English, German, French and as much Kilrathi as humanely possible).
 
3 durangos all I can come up with are the Intrepid and the Tango, what is the third. Same with the Confederations all I know of is the Concordia, I assume the Ranger other than the Victory is the Tarawa or am I wrong? Just 1 more question I swear, where did the ships on the ship list come from?
 
3 Durangos: TCS Durango, TCS Delphi (Intrepid) and the BWS Tango.

2 Confederations: TCS Confederation, TCS Concordia.

2 Rangers: TCS Ranger, TCS Victory.

The Tarawa is an escort carrier converted from a batch of transports. We don't know the name of her class (although we do know the names of every ship in her class -- we just don't know what the nameship is...).

The ships list is a list of all the capital ships named thus far in canon Wing Commander products. The data was gathered by myself, and then gone over with Captain Johnny.
 
I am somewhat... nay, *very* confused about the point LividLiquid is trying to make by saying that "a lot of things Origin has said were not true". This statement makes no sense whatsoever, because Origin never lies about a product that has been completed (and if they lie about a product that is not yet completed, then they're not actually lying).
The temperature in this room right now is, according to my thermometer, 26.5 degrees Celsius. This is a fact, analogous to Origin saying Priv2 is in the WC universe.
The temperature tomorrow will probably be 27 degrees Celsius, maybe 28. This is a prediction, analogous to Origin saying that they will be making a new game called Maniac Missions.
By your logic, LividLiquid, if my prediction about tomorrow's temperature turns out to be wrong, then the fact that it is 26.5 degrees here right now somehow also becomes a lie.


On a sidenote, I am also very disturbed by the fact that there was a time when I would have agreed with LividLiquid senseless rant. Thank God people can change :).
 
To be fair, Origin never said that they'd make Maniac Missions -- that was a nasty rumor started by CGW...:) (Maniac Missions was essentially a joke taken seriously by an CGW article... the rest is history).
 
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