EPISODE 3 Discussion

Manboy

Rear Admiral
Atekimogus said:
I watched the movie tonight and I think it's really the best of the new ones but there were a few things I didn't understand.

1. How is it possible to misinterpret the prophecy saying that the chosen one will bring balance to the force. I mean there is a whole jedi order with I do not know how many jedis and obviously there aren't that much sith running around. So of course balance would mean a shift to the dark side.....

Well he does give rise to the Sith which are well outnumbered by the Jedi - and he does end up killing the Emperor at the end of it all. Its all up to interpretation.....
 

Lord Tauk

Spaceman
I'm more of a lurker when I check this board, however.. to answer why Kenobi left Anakin to burn alive, rather than to just take him out of his misery.. I believe he let the will of the "force" decide his fate, however, no one is stupid. Kenobi probably did figure he was going to die. It really doesn't make a whole lot of sense even after explaining it the best reason you can come up with. This info about that question is what I got from reading Star Wars boards on theforce.net, etc. etc.

I was also curious to see if it was going to be explained the whole "Syfo Dias" or whatever his name was, the guy who supposeably ordered the clones. Aparently after again reading on Star Wars forums, the best answer to why the Clone Army exist is that some jedi named Syfo Dias (?) ten years before Attack of the Clones, which was around The Phantom Menace put in an order for a Clone Army, I guess you can really say Clone Military. However, from what I've read.. it seems that Palpatine actually ordered it under the name of Syfo Dias (?), then Palpatine or Dooku erased Kamino from the archives. It'd have to Palpatine because he also got the Kamino guys to put in the genetic string to were the clones will turn on the Jedi, Order 66. I dont know why they'd do that knowing this would happen, I guess money is money. That's one explanation you can consider. It's really not explained, it might be in EU but I don't follow much Star Wars EU anymore. I'm just going to enjoy it for what it is.

I have yet to see Episode 3, but Im anxious to actually see what everyones (the jedi) reactions are when the clones suddenly turn on them in the middle of whatever they are doing after Palpatine gives Order 66 out. I bet that's an eye opener. I've pretty much browsed through screenshots, and everything that goes along with that kind of stuff so it's not going to be real shocking for me to watch Episode 3, except I haven't seen the actual complete movie with dialog, etc. etc.

I would have never believed a Star Wars movie would be rated PG-13. Seems like only yesterday, the Phantom Menace debuted.
 

LeHah

212 Squadron - "The Old Man's Eyes And Ears"
Porthos said:
Pedro, grow up. I own a rifle. I have yet to kill anyone in the 9 years I've owned it.

Then do us all the favor of putting it to use with the business end of it in your mouth.
 

Edfilho

Cry some more!
I'll tell porthos what I told other people before him:
Please keep up, you will eventually get yourself banned, and averyone will be happier.

Leh Hah, did you watch the movie yet? what did you think?
 

Kon

Spaceman
Episode III was awesome...although I really don't think that Hayden is the part at all...he's very monotonous, although no one can destroy a Lucas picture.
 

LeHah

212 Squadron - "The Old Man's Eyes And Ears"
Edfilho said:
LeHah, did you watch the movie yet? what did you think?

Absolutely fantastic. I was expecting something good but that was really, really good. It had some glaring errors but it was by far and wide the best Star Wars movie since Empire Strikes Back.
 

vindicator

Rear Admiral
I skipped through to avoid spoilers. I haven't seen it yet, but I was wondering about the PG-13 and what was the violence scale? if you were to say 10 being very violent. I am curious because I was going to take my younger cousins to see it until I saw the PG-13.

-Rance-
 

BradMick

Vice Admiral
yeah, its pretty hardcore violence wise....yeah, i dunno that i would necessarily say its better than the original trilogy, but it certainly ranks up there with them. easily fourth on my list, with eps 1 and 2 pretty well tied for last place.

great, great film. Lucas redeemed himself in my eyes :)
 

Edfilho

Cry some more!
The cantina scene has ONE severed limb...

Yeah, I liked it too, even though they had to make everything happen PRETTY FAST. They could have made two movies from the plot of this one... 2 hundred cuts per scene... But I liked it. Funny how close it follows Season 2 from the cartoon.
 

LeHah

212 Squadron - "The Old Man's Eyes And Ears"
Dyret said:
Like the cantina scene from the first movie?

Six limbs from three major characters get lopped off. I'm sure theres more beyond that though.
 

Starkey

Avenging Rooster
Lord Tauk said:
I was also curious to see if it was going to be explained the whole "Syfo Dias"

Heh. Brazilian translators had a hard time with some of the names in the new trilogy.

Syfo Dias sounds exactly like "Fucked Himself" in Portuguese - They translated it as Sydo Dias

Dooku sounds like "from the a**hole", so it was translated as Dookan.

Panaka (from Ep.1) means "dumbass" in Portuguese, so they changed it to Pakuna.
 

Delance

Victory, you say?
The movie is good. As for the review, I think this one says something of interest:

The first two prequels met with widespread disappointment, though I was an enthusiastic proponent of both films. Only now, with the saga finally complete, do I fully appreciate in retrospect the extent to which the opportunity of the first two films was squandered. Yes, I admit it: I was wrong. The scales have fallen from my eyes. (I thought about writing new reviews of Episodes I and II, but on rereading them I find that I still mostly agree with what I wrote at the time, though I have more to say now, all critical. Instead of revising my reviews, therefore, I’ve supplemented them with short “final thoughts” sections [I, II] expressing my new difficulties.)

Unfortunately, the allegedly “narrow, dogmatic” Jedi orthodoxy never finds an equally articulate spokesman, not even in Obi-Wan or Yoda. Told by Anakin (in what may be a swipe at George W. Bush) that “If you’re not with me then you’re my enemy,” Obi-Wan retorts, “Only a Sith deals in absolutes.” (Really? The Jedi rejection of the dark side isn’t absolute?) And Yoda, his speech patterns sounding more convoluted and less sage-like than ever, has a final speech on the Jedi precept of detachment that goes well beyond Christian freedom from excessive attachment into Buddhist impassiveness. Attachment, Yoda teaches, is “a way to the dark side,” and our detachment and acceptance of death should be so complete that we shouldn’t even mourn the dead.

The problem with Yoda’s ethic of detachment is that it’s dead contrary to the unabashed humanism with which the whole story ends in Return of the Jedi, where human attachments — filial loyalty, paternal bonds — ultimately save the galaxy, destroy the Sith and the Empire, and redeem Anakin’ lost soul. Yoda and Obi-Wan consistently counsel Luke (and, in the prequels, Anakin) against the very bonds that finally lead to the triumph of good over evil.

In the end, alas, the Jedi do seem too “narrow” and “dogmatic,” not the great sages Lucas presumably wanted them to be. Perhaps the “prophecy of the one who will bring balance to the Force” was misinterpreted after all: Perhaps the prophecy was really fulfilled not by Anakin destroying the Sith order, but by Luke humanizing the Jedi ethic.

http://decentfilms.com/reviews/starwars3.html

I said it before on EPII, but EPIII makes it clear, the Jedi indifference throws Anakin to the Dark Side as much as the Sith corruption.

You want to go free your mother from slavery? Tough luck, love leads to the dark side.

Oh, you are having nightmares about your mother and want to save her? Hey, dreams pass in time. Attachments are evil.

Hey, more dreams about someone you love? Dude, you must train yourself to not care about people. If something bad happens, don't do anything. You're a Jedi.

This is just plain horrible. No wonder the dark side looked so interesting to Anakin. Jedi answer to any potential suffering is not caring at all.

The incredible part is that they do the same thing with Luke on EPV and EPVI. Let Vader torture your friends. Kill your own father! Yoda give the same speech about killing someone you care about to Obi-Wan and Luke. Obi-Wan don’t even try to turn Anakin from the Dark side, he just laments and draw his lightsaber first.

Luke won because, I think, he choose not to follow the Jedi indifference but to act like a man. Caring turned Anakin and, in the end, was the undoing of the Emperor. The good that was still in Vader was that he cared about his son, not even being a Sith lord made him indifferent to that. Suffering because Luke was in pain is what set him free from the chains of the dark side. Compassion, not indifference, was the victory.

Jedi compassion is based on a vague love for everyone in general, not particular individuals. Of course that doesn’t work.

The reason for this, however, is deeper. George Lucas, apparently like Joseph Campbell, subscribes to a particular view about this subject that is voiced by Yoda. Suffering always leads to the dark side. It makes no difference if it's suffering from a moral evil, or because someone happened to someone you love. Suffering for being a bad or compassionate is the same. Of course that's bull, but hey, the movies were built on this premise. Luckily, for a reason or another, the Original Trilogy escaped from this fate.

EDIT: Yeah, I get it, Lucas is a Gasbag and utter a lot of nonsense. And he can't write a romantic scene, much less direct it. Even the action scenes were not as dramatic as they could be, but they were much superior the the avarege.
 

Pedro

Admiral
d3r3k said:
am i the only one who didn't like this movie?

Yes. I just saw it tonight and was very impressed.
Oh sure they built up the twist about... well you know... like there was ANY chance anyone wouldn't get it the instant anakin had that vision of... you know, damn spoilers...
But it linked the films beautifuly, it was enjoyable. It could have been a lot better if the other characters had expressed more emotion over the turning of anakin... but that was no worse than a missed opportunity; there were many more opportunites snatched or created than were missed this time around. Bravo Mr Lucas, this one was truly worthy of the name Star Wars.
 
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