cloaking question

I believe that I requested you to. Hmm...

Paladin's French accent,
Blair's history in the Prophecy Mission Guide book, stating that his father died and his mother raised him, as opposed to them dying at the same time,
The lack of Pilgrims in the WC games.

Go ahead. I dare you.
What are you, chicken? BAWK, BAWK BAWK BAWK!
(Just kidding. But really, enlighten me, so I don't look like a dope next time I open my yap)
 
Since Paladin's Scottish accent was fake (The Price of Freedom, p. 26), it stands to reason that his French accent was also a put-on related to his position as spy...

Blair's biological parents are Arnold and Devi Blair -- at age four, Blair was sent to Nephele where he was raised by Arnold's sister Jennifer and her husband. It was this husband who was killed in a farming accident, and it was Jennifer who went offworld and remarried. Blair was then raised to adulthood by his grandparents. It is these grandparents to whom he sends letters in Wing Commander Academy -- mentioning that they opposed his going to the Academy. The military officer who appears to him in 'Expendable' is Arnold Blair.

As for the lack of Pilgrims, there are two explanations.

The first is the simple fact that there's absolutely no way to prove that there are no Pilgrims in later games. We see a tiny little slice of the Wing Commander Universe -- I mean, we don't see any Catholics or any Jewish people... does that mean *those* religions don't exist?

That said, the next Wing Commander novel, Pilgrim Truth (outline available at the CIC) centers around the initial group of Pilgrims returning from wherever they ascended and taking back with them almost all the remaining Pilgrims...
 
Well, I'll be a Kilrathi's uncle. That wasn't too shabby...

Still, there looks like some very major differences between the game timelines and the movie. What about Bossman? You fly with him, and off memory, he doesn't die until Secret Ops 1 (though I'm probably wrong). There's also the incredible design differences between the movie and games, as well as Manaic's friendship with Blair (they don't like each other too much in the books, and even in the games they only seem to talk because they're both pilots).

That's it, I'm getting a Handbook. And reading some more novels.
 
Hmm... what are we talking about now? How WCM contradicts with WC1? Well.. the whole time frame is screwed up..
 
That would be an understatement! Someone should re publish a sort of "corrected" book on all this, by taking all exsisting material and games and publishing something with more accurate definitions and explanations. "Hmm..who would want to build it!" [Quote, Dr. Marcus/Star Trek: The Wrath of Khan]

RFB
 
We don't really know Bossman's story, since no source to explain it exists... it's been a source of much discussion over the years, and only one logical story makes sense: Bossman was captured by the Kilrathi. The story behind his 'final' mission in the movie is known, as the Confed handbook includes Angel's letter to his wife... essentially, his fighter was damaged fighting a delaying action and he was killed "instantly" by radiation. Since we know from the other non-movie novels that CO's tend to claim that loved ones were killed in action rather than be captured in letters home, we might guess that that's what has happened here -- Bossman ejected from his damaged fighter and was captured by the Kilrathi. The damaged fighter was then recovered and given to Blair... Angel wrote the letter home claiming he was dead, because the alternative was too horrific.

That's all speculation, though -- it's a story that hasn't been told yet.

As for the position in the timeline, the movie has absolutely no contradiction -- it takes place immediately after the first episode of Wing Commander Academy, when Blair & Maniac are assigned to the Tiger's Claw... in March. (About a month before Wing Commander 1, which starts in April).

As for Maniac and Blair -- they've been described from the start as friends who compete (although their relationship has clearly soured during the darker days of the war in Wing 3).
 
Do you have the Wing Commander I - II Strategy Guide? It clearly states bossman died when the tigers claw went b00m.
 
I have one of the original ones signed by Roberts (the promotional release) and then three or four of the regular editions that he later signed.
 
Wow LOAF, your ever-loving knowledge and collection of Wingnut memorabelia is incredible. Now, I will roll my eyes.

But you never answered my question!

If you talk to Bossman, then why, in the movie, does Blair express surprise over Bossman not being around? And if dead pilots "never existed" like Angel says, why are Mule-Skinner and lovable Tooner listed as having been killed in Claw Marks?

[Edited by Nep Parth on 04-03-2001 at 18:26]
 
That's because WC1 takes place *after* the movie <G> Bossman 'died' before Blair even knew him... (although he'd *heard* of the man, hence his reaction when he found out whose fighter he was sitting in...).

The same thing applies to the 'you die, you never existed' thing -- that concept "ended" during the movie, so the 2654/4 (April) Claw Marks doesn't mention it.

Not that Claw Marks would, anyway -- the 'never existed' thing was something that was only practiced by Angel's squadron -- one of several squadrons on the 'Claw.

(And, actually, they *talk* about Tooner and Mule-Skinner's deaths in the movie! Rosie and Maniac's first patrol together opens with her saying that if Lt. Dibbles were a woman he'd still be alive...)
 
I hate you loaf.... also
In SWC, it shows that the beginning of WC1 was Blairs (or Armstrong in that game)'s first tour of duty, so that rules out your whole explenation.

(P.S. - Im always trying to find a gap in LOAF's Wing Commander Knowledge banks.)
 
AARRGH! What I meant was, you TALK to Bossman in the game! If it takes place after the movie, which is after Bossman died, then how could you talk to him in the game?

And I caught the Dibbles thing too. I was a little surprised, since when you died, you never existed. Maybe they didn't like Tooner.
 
Sorry, I wasn't clear... he must have been *captured* in the movie, and then rescued sometime before WC1... allowing him to return to the Tiger's Claw.

Tooner and Dibbles were Blue Devil's, though, not Black Lions -- so they could exist <G>
 
Speaking of which, did anyone else find it odd that it wasn't proper to take out two fighters, except for the fact that you have to take on quite a few fighters in a Hornet.

I think Ace status should be reached on your hundreth kill, not your 5th. This happens in WC3 and 4 novels...why do they underestimate the pilots so much? If I'm piloting an Arrow, I see two Dralthi, they're toast...even if I'm playing on Nightmare. No problemo! But, even in the manual, Flint says, "The Arrow is nothing to shout about". The killboard doesn't reflect the kills, either; all the pilots have at least 60 by the end of WC3 (if they're not dead). The same goes for WCP (though Maniac gave me quite a lot of competition...I didn't pass him until about halfway through the game).

Finally, wingmen are promoted with you, aren't they? So if a wingman not your friend anymore if you're promoted over him? But thank you for the clarification.
 
I think it's more a case of who followed Angel's rule about people not existing -- Maniac and Rosie didn't seem to take it seriously, whereas Hunter and Angel did.

(Of course, we know Dibbles and Blair didn't like eachother <G>).

100 kills earns you a century award, according to the WCIV novel <G> But the vast majority of fighter pilots probably die before scoring even five kills... (ditto, the Kilrathi and their 8 kills to be a Drakhai -- most die without destroying 8 of our ships). The killboards never show the carrier's entire compliment... just the people you can have as wingmen. You don't see, for instance, Bacon Boy or Weasel on the Victory's chart <G>
 
Poor Dibbles and his arrogance. I can feel for him, though.
Still, the books underestimate the kill capacity of a pilot. In the books, Flint is trying to get 20 kills. THat's since her father died, which was about 1-4 YEARS ago (I might have the dates wrong, since the novel isn't sitting right next to me, but you get the point). I hit 20 kills within my first 6 missions. And, if you count WC3-SO, I'd have about 9 Century awards. And I'm probably not even the best pilot here!
 
Hehe... but Blair *was* an unusually talented pilot... one of the two truly great pilots of his generation <G> (He and Maniac were the only two post-CC pilots who obtained such incredible killscores...)
 
That's true. Maniac did score his 2001st kill before Prophecy, and in my game, he got up to about 350 in the game. But I haven't been flying my whole life, only about 3 years!

Manaic is ranked 14th on the All-Time list, and Blair is 11th, with each being the highest-decorated aces in Confed history (Blair the highest, Maniac the highest in active service). Yet, I'm nearly up to half his lifetime total! And you've got me beaten by 6-7 years. What's your WC lifetime total like? Really, they underestimate the players.

I think I could take Blair. Unless he cheats, and uses his Pilgrim Powers, or the Force. :)

"Pilgrim Power!"
 
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