Is Chris Roberts a racism?

Discussion in 'Off-topic Zone' started by Calzone, Jul 5, 2002.

  1. Bandit LOAF

    Bandit LOAF Long Live the Confederation!

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    Maybe the wording is bad: 'anti-war' brings to mind college students ranting about how we should all live together happily. The Greeks had a little bit more realistic view... and they certainly appreciated irony. The Iliad is more of a 'what hath our honor wrought?' look at war. You have Hektor and Achilles portrayed as the two absolutely most noble individuals forced to fight and die on opposing sides because they're bound to defend the honor of men who are painted as ignoble and dishonorable. It's not a blatant "we must stop war!" rant type of thing (although it does dabble in that -- the horrific violence and such... what sticks in my mind right now is Hektor's son not recognizing him because he's wearing his war helmet) -- but it's definately a very ironic portrayal... these are the best of men and they must suffer because of their nature. Certainly the story of the Trojan war was originally 'war is great, we went and fought, yay'... but Homer gives it a decidedly 'look at this and see that it's wrong' bent.
     
  2. the__phoenix

    the__phoenix Spaceman

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    @calzone: It seems to me, that you dislike american policy as much as I do, but if Stoiber wins the elections in germany everything will go down there as well. I experienced it in our country after the FPÖ got 27% of the votes and teamed up with the ÖVP, which is the austrian counterpart of the CDU.

    BTW, A good english <-> german dictonary is the Langenscheidt T1, where you can easily cut 'n paste from websites or translate single words.
     
  3. Ridgerunner

    Ridgerunner Vice Admiral

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    General MacArthur explained it best:

    No one abhors war more than the soldier. For it is he who must bear the worst of it all, and may be called upon to give his life.



    (I'm not quoting him, this is the best I can remember. He said it much better.)
     
  4. Calzone

    Calzone Spaceman

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    @Phoenix: I also fear, that Stoiber could win the election and that germany than is a little america even more. But Schröder was also a nut who just told, what other want to hear.

    About the dictionary: The english words aren´t that problem, but the sentences. :D

    But maybe everyone should speak german. It would make it a lot of simpler :p
     
  5. Calzone

    Calzone Spaceman

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    @Quarto: My examples are meaningless? Why? Because they don´t fit in your (strange) view about a clean and honorable army which never exists. And please... don´t tell me about Erwin Rommel. He was just a career-addicted officer, who was forced to suicide by a moron, who couldn´t see the truth.

    And just some segments of the wehrmacht are doing awfull things. then told me please, why the OKW (Oberkommando der Wehrmacht (the head of the wehrmacht)) does bring out this instruction which i mentioned before?.

    Here are some other examples OKW instructions (awfully translated, as ever :D :

    In consideration of the atrocities committed at German soldiers in principle all Mongols and Asian are to be shot from now starting from, indifferently whether it concerns prisoners of war, defectors or taken up civilians

    "The soldier in the east are not only a fighter after the rules of the war, but also carriers of an inexorable German idea. Therefore the soldier have to understand the hard punishment to the Jewish race. That is the only way as we can fit in our historical role as Libarators from Germany."
     
  6. Quarto

    Quarto Unknown Enemy

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    Excuse me, but who are you to tell me my view is strange? You're the one who's basically suggesting that the German soldiers were perfectly normal until 1934, then they suddenly became a pack of monsters for ten years, and then in 1945, they just as suddenly went back to being normal again. Because that is essentially what any claim that the entire Wehrmacht was bad amounts to.

    I wasn't going to, but since you bring him up... you call him career-addicted? Then why did he refuse to obey Hitler's orders regarding harsh treatment of prisoners? Falling into disfavour with the leader of your country because you want to treat your prisoners in a humane manner... that's a pretty strange thing for a career-addicted officer to do, isn't it?
     
  7. Calzone

    Calzone Spaceman

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    1. Many of the Generals in the Wehrmacht were forced to leave out, because they don´t fit in Hitlers plan. Canaris was a perfect example for that. The Wehrmacht soldiers get their orders from a "Hitler friendly" General staff. And they followed those orders.

    2. Rommel never execute prisoners of war. But he always do as much as possible to save Hitler´s sympathetic consideration. So he wrote postcards which shows the Course of the front, he said sentences like "The Leader trust in me, and that is all i need." and he always used his influences to promote his career. Of course that aren´t crimes, but it shows the character of a career-addicted person.
     
  8. Mekt-Hakkikt

    Mekt-Hakkikt Mpanty's bane

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    Because in the OKW were either stout followers of the Nazui regime or because they hadn't the possibility to distort Hitler's orders (and I assume that the idea came from him, at least in the beginning) maybe?
     
  9. Calzone

    Calzone Spaceman

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    The OKW was fascinated about the plans that Hitler have and his success in the beginning (Austria, Tschecheslowakia [or however it was called in english]) proves that he was right (at least in their eyes). So they followed him until they saw that Hitler will destroy the german empire.

    @Quarto: I would like to recommend a book to you. It called "Legende der sauberen Wehrmacht" or in English "the legend of the clean Wehrmacht". It is very interesting and shows how deep the Wehrmacht was interlaced with the holocaust and other crimes which the nazis done.
     

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