Phillip Tanaka
Swabbie
Banned
I found that too. I didn't care for Commander Devereaux nearly as much as I cared for Angel.
Why was the traitor sub plot cut out?
- Thread starter Delance
- Start date
Swabbie
I found that too. I didn't care for Commander Devereaux nearly as much as I cared for Angel.
LeHah
212 Squadron - "The Old Man's Eyes And Ears"
"Wipe Them Out. All Of Them."
Enough said.
It is easy to steal the bullshit from other people's sails and complain about the exact same things, but I happen to defend both movies because I see a lot more good than I do wrong. TPM has a coherant and solid plot (unlike Episode 2), fantastic production design, good action sequences, great music and sets up a backstory for a major epic.
Wing Commander, though suffering from bad editing, has a supporting cast that is second to none. It also has great special effects and production design. Tcheky Karyo pulled of a fantastic Paladin, breathing life into a second-rate plot.
I also happen to enjoy the "Masters Of The Universe" movie. Frank Langella as Skeletor is something I cannot even begin to go into. Yeah, the movie and script are crap, but that single performance brought the movie up quite a bit.
The problem isn't the movies. I think it's the fact you're spoonfed the idea that its "cool" to pick at movies that everyone else has already done once-over.
If someone wanted to "Destroy The Universe", that sounds like a set-up for one frickin hell of a good movie. All you need now are some Nazis, a guy who smokes and drinks too much and Batman in mech.
I will once I know what 'wront' is.
WC is not by any means a masterpeice. But just because idiot American press gives it bad reviews does not stop it from getting positive reviews in the rest of the world. The movie did well in both the UK and Asia.
Is it a peice of cinematic history? Nah. But if you read between the lines in it and read the movie novelization, it's a really solid story.
The movie failed to generate an audience since commercials only ran during commercial breaks on "Pokemon". The advertising campaign was terrible for the movie and was unable to reach any audience outside core fans and random passer-bys.
As for the heros, I only gave two shits about Angel, Taggart and Tolwyn. Sorry, I really like Karyo and David Warner, no matter the role. I'm biased in that sense. Saffron was good in her role, and well suited.
Delance
Victory, you say?
What? The evil Roger Ebert also said the supporting cast of WC was very good. So I can't agree with him, but you can? How unfair!
No kidding. If your title and picture didn't suggest it, your taste for the dialogue of TPM would.
And with the armor he was even gayer than on the cartoon, an accomplishment.
Monica from friends also did help. And Evil Lyn was hot.
Sounds like Frank Miller, but no one liked Robocop 2.
Idiot brazilian press gave it bad reviews too. But this time, for a chance, they were right.
A story that pales when compared with WC2, WC3 or WC4 IMO.
Yeah, blame the marketing. Sure, it's all their fault. They are evil. Good movies that succeed because of word-of-mouth are an urban legend, of course. Only they aren't.
Phillip Tanaka
Swabbie
Banned
Yeah, I liked Saffron Burrows too in the movie. It was actually fun watching Devereaux damn near burst a blood vessel imitating Gunnery Hartman.
Anyway, I like Wing Commander and Street Fighter. The Full Monty, Independence Day, Tomb Raider, Police Acadamy and The Mask. Some people might think those movies are the worst ever made. Yeah, so? What's your point? What matters to me is that I enjoy them. I'm sure there are things that I don't like, say, mass murder on a scale that had never been achieved, that other people would love.
Anyway, I like Wing Commander and Street Fighter. The Full Monty, Independence Day, Tomb Raider, Police Acadamy and The Mask. Some people might think those movies are the worst ever made. Yeah, so? What's your point? What matters to me is that I enjoy them. I'm sure there are things that I don't like, say, mass murder on a scale that had never been achieved, that other people would love.
Aries
Vice Admiral
Originally posted by Delance
Yeah, blame the marketing. Sure, it's all their fault. They are evil. Good movies that succeed because of word-of-mouth are an urban legend, of course. Only they aren't.
actually, marketing determines whether or not the movie will be a success more than the actual movie. Enemy at the Gates - excellent movie, right up there with Saving Private Ryan. didn't do to good cause there wasn't very much marketing. American Pie - one of the stupidest movies ever made. did so well they actually made another one. was a success because of good marketing. 'nuff said.
LeHah
212 Squadron - "The Old Man's Eyes And Ears"
The only person he made note of was David Warner. Fool.
The day you're a Tony award winning actor who plays Dracula, Scrooge and worked with a ton of incredible directors like Roman Polanski, I'll consider your vapid and uselessly biased opinon. Until then, I'll pay more attention to my magical talking lawn mower more than anything you vomit forth like a newborn.
Wow. Moebius designed that armor, and that man does no wrong after doing ten years of Heavy Metal, and movies like The Fifth Element, Willow and Alien.
Not to mention, the fact that you have to show distaste and are obviously threatened for people with a different lifestyle than you (or you're just a closet case for Daddy), should secure yourself as one of the future banned members of this board.
And you complain about my taste? Thats frickin Cagney from Cagney and Lacey. Yeesh.
You for got Miller also penned Robocop 3. And that Marquand directed Robocop 2... and Empire Strikes Back.
I actually like Robocop 2.
So, wait, they're stupid and right? Make up your mind. I don't even have to tell you what you are; you're doing that for me.
And all those stories pale to, say, Twin Peaks. There's always something better. But I happen to like the WC movie story a lot. If you don't, well, you're just damned not to like it. Live with it. Move on. Accept the fact that you're in the minority when most people here can find a lot of good in it and you're just another lost, whiny brat.
What are you blathering about? Good movies succeed if they're seen. Who the heck is going to see a movie that got a rather sullen release in theaters and a bad ad campaign. No one!
Look, you have every right to have an opinion, but it doesn't mean you're safe from a swift kick to your complacency. Drop it and move on.
I'd say marketing plays a rather large role in the box office draw of a movie, why else would studios pay anywhere from 1/10 to 1/4 the cost of a movie to advertise it? Take ST:Nemesis for example. I thought the advertising was ok, but 3 seconds just about made me lose faith in the movie. The line "Set a course for Earth, kill everything" (which wasn't even in the movie, they just edited it together from different dialogues) was just so cheesy and B-movieish that a rather hardcore TNG fan like myself started having second thoughts about actually going and seeing it. That's just an example of how 3 seconds of bad advertising can affect someone in the publics opinion of the movie and maybe even their choice to go see it.
And new dude, it's called an open-mind. You might want to look into it sometime (maybe you should start with the second part of the word)
C-ya
And new dude, it's called an open-mind. You might want to look into it sometime (maybe you should start with the second part of the word)
C-ya
1. The armor's nice, but they could have kept with the color scheme... you know, that garish construction-barrel orange. Makes more sense for an ejected pilot to be as visible as possible, than to just look cool.
2. The marketing, reviews, word of mouth... let's face it. Not many people liked the movie. Hell, I don't like the movie. I like the original, un-battered plot, but I simply didn't like the finished product. It seems unfinished and butchered.
3. American Pie was so popular for the same reason that Jerry Springer is... sensationalism and disfunctional sexual behaviour.
Enemy at the Gates was somewhat popular. Problem was it came in the midst of many better movies, and didn't get the attention it deserved... part of the reason WCM didn't get enough attention is they pasted the Star Wars: Episode One preview on it... watching 90 seconds of what appears to be "Jesus reborn"(you can't deny that preview was awesome) and then sitting through 90 minutes of butchered screenplay and poor acting... granted, the fighter scenes were good. Damn good.
2. The marketing, reviews, word of mouth... let's face it. Not many people liked the movie. Hell, I don't like the movie. I like the original, un-battered plot, but I simply didn't like the finished product. It seems unfinished and butchered.
3. American Pie was so popular for the same reason that Jerry Springer is... sensationalism and disfunctional sexual behaviour.
Enemy at the Gates was somewhat popular. Problem was it came in the midst of many better movies, and didn't get the attention it deserved... part of the reason WCM didn't get enough attention is they pasted the Star Wars: Episode One preview on it... watching 90 seconds of what appears to be "Jesus reborn"(you can't deny that preview was awesome) and then sitting through 90 minutes of butchered screenplay and poor acting... granted, the fighter scenes were good. Damn good.
Dear lord! Your wit(and your claws) have apparently sharpened since I visited last... That was positively hateful! Well done!
HeartoftheTiger
Rear Admiral
Small mistake here. He directed "Return of the Jedi", not "The Empire strikes back".
HAVE A NICE DAY
Heart of the Tiger
Corsair(pilot)
Spaceman
It.... was.... funny.... just because you people don't think it was, does not mean that it wasn't.... I went to see American pie without having a clue what it was about, and laughed my ass off. So did everybody else in the theatre.....
Sure there are elements which play into the equation, but you cannot blame certain factors for causing a film to be unsuccessful, except for people just NOT GOING TO SEE IT.
Ghost
Emperor
Originally posted by Starkey
Don´t spill any more fuel on that fire, Delance. Cursing *The Movie* when LeHah is near will only lead to banning, thread closing, weeping and gnashing of teeth.
Why? he is giving his opinion.
Unless you insult another fellow CZ, why he can´t give his opinion.
Lehah´s ¨wanna be bad-ass¨ attitude is pretty stupid, that shouldn´t disencourage people to say their opinions.
Delance
Victory, you say?
Well, I refuse to respond to a stupid troll like LeHah. Let he pick a fight with someone else with his pathetic flame-baits and insults. I kept the conversation until this moment because I thought this was a moderated forum, but apparently it's as free as agwc. It's a good thing, actually. Freedom is good, my friends, just ignore trolls and spammers.
But I must admit, however, that when it comes to stupid insults, he at least deserves recognition for creativity: only finding wisdom on opinions professed by Tony-winner magical vampire lawn mowers is something new.