I must be nuts.


Vice Admiral
i have no problems with wcp, but wc3 is my fav wc game... i have and old pentium 1 200 mhz pc wich i want to use soon for some old school games like wc 1,2,3,4, tie fighter, x-wing and old games that can't run on this machine because it's too fast...


I have to simply agree in that Privateer is an absolutely amazing game and I am so grateful for Origin for truly - creating worlds. Privateer was an open, living, breathing game which felt so wonderful to play. The three favorite games of all time, for me, are Strike Commander, Privateer, and Wings of Glory. Testament to origin. You're in for a great time. :)


Privateer 2 was . . . is great (I still need to go back and finish it). I can't understand the backlash against it because it wasn't a 'second Privateer'.



Victory, you say?
And Privateer ships had personality. You could even get the Orion, good for transport AND fighting. Now take Freelancer, or Priv2, and there's no such thing.

One major issue on Freelancer is that you *had* to buy a very heavy fighter to max out on shields and weapons. Why couldn't the player have a top light fighter or transport? And where was the ship good for transport and fighting, like the Orion?

This is the kind of game that advertises freedom, yet few delivers.
Exactly. For a privateer/crago/pirate game like Privateer 4-6 ships are more than enough. Make everyone really different so everyone can buy HIS ship for HIS playingstyle and then create a load of gimmiks to upgrade them. What are 50 ships in darkening good for if you are buying only 4 of them in the end because only those upgrades make a difference, the rest is more or less remaining the same.
Huge load of enemy ships and stations and planets and so on, that is good to make a good universe, to always find something new. But the player ships, 4-6 are enough by far.
LOAF said it already, in privateer you didn't fly mission after mission with one ship to get the money for the next and so on, you flew one mission additional to the script stuff because you knew it would enable you to buy the IFF system for your radar, to actually SEE if its friend or foe fliying around out there. To get an Afterburner! To finally get the jump drive, which wasn'T even necessary in the beginning since your ship was hardly good enough to prevail in the relatively peacful starting system. Those gimmiks which all really made a difference and the game world to explore made it so much fun. Not thousands of playable ships which more or less all feel the same anyway (which is naturally, how do you want to make 100 ships really DIFFERENT from one another, in the end you end up with 4 interesting ships again) or 100 sectors which are all the same in different color. That was also a very good aspect of Tachyon.. Those bases really looked different and very intersting. Something fun a huge base looking totally different as a present for finally reaching a new sector (although the rest of the game wasn't that good)

Guns GG

I agree, the RPG aspects of Privateer are as good as it gets. There is always one more thing that is juuuusssttt out of reach, which is the hallmark of any good rpg. The gameplay is well balanced untill you get halfway into the plot...(I never have made it thru the 20-30 kazillion kilrathi in the beta sector.....I've searched for a yarn thrower to no avail). There ARE people who have made it all the way thru, and I tip my pirate hat to them!

The ships are well balanced...You have the Galaxy, which will haul a LOT of cargo, defends itself well (better than the Tarsus anyway), The Centurian, which is a courier ship that can haul a little cargo and is FAST.(and everyones favorite for the plot missions) Then the Orion, which is a flying tank!

I think one of the GG's actually made it thru the whole game once in the Tarsus...LOAF may remember better than I. One of the advantages of being a GG is that everytime you play, you are learing all over again<G>

"Privateer 2 was . . . is great (I still need to go back and finish it). I can't understand the backlash against it because it wasn't a 'second Privateer'."

Well, it WAS advertized as privateer 2....and it doesn't utilize Wing commander jump points and you can't fly cargo ships! If we just wanted fighters, then we wouldn't have asked for another privateer game, the wing commander fighters were good enough for that! <G>. Not that I didn't enjoy Priv2----it just wasn't Privateer2!!!!
It really wasn't even an Origin game...but it has been so long I don't remember the full story.

Bandit LOAF

Long Live the Confederation!
Privateer 2 was developed by "Origin UK", which is now Warthog (or... was in 1999, at least, companies change faster than I can keep up). The project was lead by Erin Roberts, who's been with Wing Commander since the original game (and Privateer!). Some of the Origin guys we know and love ended up working on it at the end... I believe it may have been Captain Johnny's first published game. It was originally pitched as 'Privateer: The Darkening', as a Privateer spinoff (but not as Privateer 2)... and then as 'The Darkening'... and then finally as 'Privateer 2: The Darkening' when the Chris Roberts-produced Privateer 2 mass-media project was cancelled.

Privateer 2 has a heck of a lot of weird gameplay balancing issues that should have been sorted out in development... and, of course, there was the general 'weird' factor (that I really liked - the European movie production was neat in my mind, but confusing to a lot of people). It's a shame, because there really was a lot going for Privateer 2 - it had more missions than any other WC game (by a factor of three or so), it had amazing artwork, and a 3D engine far superior to anything else published around that time (you could display thirty or forty ships at once on a 486!).

I'm in the process of getting a copy of the Privateer 2 Post Mortem from a former Origin employee... the post mortem is the document the team does after the game is released to analyze what went right and what went wrong. It should be fascinating, in the case of Darkening.


Frog Blast the Vent Core!
It is kind of too bad that priv2 fell short in some crucial areas while still coming out as a good game (although the minijumps and such did confuse the hell out of me the first time I looked at the map)

Priv/RF are such an amazing game and addon. I love RF simply because of the extra toys we get to mount on our ship. The first time I played priv after I got my first PC way back in who knows when, I remember spending hours building up capital so that I could get the hell out of troy and see what else the gemini sector had to offer. It was probably the most fun I had with a game the first time I ever played it. And I mean who can't love a plot that revolves around a guy who does shady dealings only to end up meeting an incredibly advanced civilization and then blowing the hell out of some retros. Amazing...simply amazing


Cry some more!
Well, I'm not going into the "Priv 2 is WC! No it's not!" argument again. All that matters is that is quite good (though nowhere near Priv1) and has few inside connections to the rest of the WCU.

My biggest problem with it was the nearly incomprehensible dialogue, coupled with the lack of subtitles!!!

It had its moments, though. The funny stuff:

The brit name calling in the comms, the accent and choice of words were hilarious.

The fact that Chris Walken is so sinister that I expected him to betray Lev Arris the whole game.

All in all, a fine piece of software - except for the bugs. Isn't it the most buggy WC game ever?


Privateer 2 "The Darkening" was indeed a great game...well still is. But I also agree with the majority, that it did not give the WC "feel" like Privateer/RF did. It takes alot more than descriptions in manuals and wording like "can travel anywhere in Confed space" to make the game present itself as part of the WC universe. But the game is a part of the WC universe..just much later in the timeline, quite some time after the time of WCP I believe.

IMO, there are only 3 ships in P2 The Darkening that are worth having during the entire game. The Freij MKII, Icarus and Drakkar (i think that is what it is called). The Icarus is a great ship once you can afford it. Holds up well till the last few missions, then your better off in the Freij class ships. But I bet it would be quite a challenge if one were to attempt to play the entire game using the "spacesuit" save game that Loaf posted here at the CIC some time ago. Ya...attack them Kindred captial ships with that spacesuit and rifle laser! :D :D


The way i always do it is to pick the fighters which match the CIS light, medium and heavy class fighters in configuration, if it's good enough for the military it's good enough for me. Kind of like buying a Taurus because Kenny Irwin Jr drove one...

P2 was not intended to be in the WC universe and was worked in after-hand. That shows, naturally, but doesn't take awya from the game's value. The only thing I did not like were the ridiculously unrealistic kill scores it would produce.


I really disliked the lack of interaction...

In priv 1 you could converse with pilots, annoy em and watch em attack you. If pirates were about, ships would help you out.

In Priv 2 civi ships would just sit there and fly around. Military ships would fight but more often than not it was you vs the never ending hords of evil.

I mean if you just sat there ships jumped in but rarely (if ever) jumped out. This left a silly number of ships just milling about the space lanes.

It does have some good points. But for me, its not got enough to make it into the good game catagory.

Also it has no Dralthi!! I mean come on, only WC2 can pull off being a wing commander game without dralthi. And thats by having one in spirit as the Drakhri.

Bandit LOAF

Long Live the Confederation!
P2 was not intended to be in the WC universe and was worked in after-hand.

As was pointed out earlier in this thread, that fact is disputed. (Looking through DejaGoogle, you can actually find early-96 posts where people complain that the 'Privateer' was *removed* from the title in the WC4 advertisement...)


Mr. Standoff
Personally, I liked the ridiculously high kill scores, because every other open-ended space sim made space look like it was populated by not more than a couple thousands of people.

I've always wondered how could space flight play such a big role in a system's economy and why there were such developed industries geared towards space flight, when you'd go out and dive into what's supposed to be a major space lane and run into no more than three dozen people per hour. :)

Of course, P2's high population also sucked, in that it made a few of the game's flaws more evident: the ridiculously unbalanced ratio of hostiles-to-friendlies, all the civilian ships that didn't have any agendas, and how you'd be stuck on a navpoint for two hours just because pirates keep showing up around you.


How can I put it bettere than Eder?

LOAF! That was news to me - I had always assumed that the game was originally developed as "The Darkening" and only somewhere well into the production, turned into a Privateer title...


Rear Admiral
Although I'm not a Privateer player, wasn't Privateer 2 and The Darkening originaly going to be two seperate games, but in Origin's early meetings they merged them together?

Bandit LOAF

Long Live the Confederation!
Yes and no. What is now Privateer 2 was originally pitched as "Privateer: The Darkening"... a Privateer 'spinoff', using a different character and setting.

At the same time in the US, a fairly crazy Privateer 2 project was developed - two interactive FMV games with a one-season TV series that'd air between them. You'd play Privateer 2, which would be about your Privateer (1) character (named 'Aaron Burton' in the outline)... and he'd have adventures with another guy, who would then go on to have adventures on a TV show. At the end of the year, Privateer 3 (developed simultaneously) would be released and it'd wrap up the story for both characters (the TV guy and the game guy).

The general failure of FMV as a cash cow coupled with Chris Roberts leaving Origin probably killed the idea at a very early stage. "Privateer: The Darkening" became The Darkening for several months... and then turned back into Privateer 2 at the last minute.


Rear Admiral

Ado said:
I dug out a ton of old parts stowed away in various closets, and built a DOS machine from them :)

so did I a couple of weeks ago.
Desktop: 486/66 with 32 MB Ram, 5,25" and 3,5" FDD, 540(504)MB HDD, 1MB Spea VEGA VL-Bus Graphics, 8X CD-Rom and a Gravis Blackhawk Joystick are connected to Soundblaster AWE 32, which I bought 1995 for about 350 Deutschmarks (roughly 170$) a 3com589(?)Nic and the first MS-Mouse(serial). OS: DOS 6.22 Games: WC1, WC2, Priv1, WC Armada, WC Academy, X-Wing, Tie-Fighter, The Last Dynasty and Doom1 & 2. Of course, all Games are Originals :). I use different Bootdisks. For Privateer, i got about 605kb free under DOS.
Another Machine I set up for older Games is an i233MMX on an Asus P55T2P4 with 128MB Ram, running WIN 98SE. It has a Matrox Mystique, coupled with a Voodoo2 Graphicsadapter and another AWE32 (Ebay, 3Euro) build in. On this Machine I'm running: WC3, WC4, 'The Darkening' (I do not consider this a Privateer sequel) & Schleichfahrt ('Archimedean Dynasty' is the English title) which I really love. This games run under Dos, I prefer Bootdisks. Of course I don't use any USB devices.
Also installed: WC Prophecy (incl. Secret Ops) , Freespace1 (incl. Silent Threat), IWar 1 (puuh, that's heavy stuff) and some more :).

Guns GG

Well, it's an ok game...I may even still have the patches for it saved somewhere on floppy.....but the Darkening is on the bottom of my Wing Commander play list.....I played it 2 or 8 times, and it has not left my CD rack since. I can't get RF to run at all, which is a shame.

I may give the Darkening another go thru. Those crazy jump points and endless enemies always bothered me though. That and having to ESCORT my cargo instead of having it safely in the hold.

Any word out of EA yet, or will they charactoristically ignore a large fan base again?

Bandit LOAF

Long Live the Confederation!
Any word out of EA yet, or will they charactoristically ignore a large fan base again?

EA looked into contracting a Wing Commander game last year - the hangup was Chris Roberts, who was/is working on developing a movie. When he's free, or when EA realizes they don't need his name to sell the game, we may hear more.

Specs for my Wing Commander machine are here. I'm still working on her, though. :)