Hex Based WC Universe strategy game (in the panzer general style)

Ron B

Master Chief Petty Officer
I quite liked Star General to be honest, I never had any problems with the game play, I'd be interested to hear what your opinion was on it.

Your game looks to be shaping up pretty well, I am liking the look of it, would be great to seize space above a planet and the land your troops
Very honestly I never got past the first mission of Star General. The graphics and gameplay put me off completely. After PG I had huge expectations. May be its just me cause a lot of people did not have an issue with Star General. Anyways, it kinda pushed me to create a WC PG mashup which is in progress. Thanks for your feedback.
 

Ron B

Master Chief Petty Officer
Will this game only be an online multiplayer game, or will it be a also a single player game?
As of now I have not written a single line of game AI. Am just working on the game dynamics and look. Till I can create a workable AI it will have to be multiplayer turn based. Am also working out the multiplayer game dynamics (see my post with capi3101 above). Any suggestions or ideas are welcome. Cheers.
 

Ron B

Master Chief Petty Officer
Yeah, that's a tough one. TacOps had that difficulty; my suggestion to those folks was to either set a time limit for movement or boot a player from the game. That didn't happen; to my knowledge Game 6 has been stuck on the current turn for the past two years as a result.

I would suggest everybody inputing their orders simultaneously and then working them out turn-by-turn, but that defeats the point of the PG mechanic. So bad suggestion.

Time limit penalties aren't exactly satisfactory...I'll give the matter some thought and see if I can come up with a better solution.
Hi, do take a look at the screens I posted above. Making good progress.
 

ChrisReid

Super Soaker Collector / Administrator
The models were created by Midnightrunner from Galciv2 in 2010. They are just incredible. There are around 50 confed and 50 Kilarathi models.
https://www.wcnews.com/news/update/9896
Were you able to download all the models successfully for your project? We mention in that update that the links were offline, but if you have a new source, that's worth letting people know.
 
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Ron B

Master Chief Petty Officer
Were you able to download all the models successfully for your project? We mention in that update that the links were offline, but if you have a new source, that's worth letting people know.
Hi Chris, The original source files are not available. I went through each post on http://forums.galciv2.com/336081 one at a time and downloaded each ship's cheat sheet and extracted the models from the .jpg files. I did manage to get a complete set for both confed and kilrathi. There's about 50 of each. Fantastic work by Midnightrunner.
 

capi3101

Rear Admiral
Sorry for the silence the last couple of days; things have been pretty hairy at work the last couple of days and I haven't had anytime to work on Elegy let alone anything else. I'm still thinking about how you'd handle Panzer General as a multi-player game; I found a PDF of the manual online over the weekend and have slowly been learning the ins and outs of the game. I've also been playing through Nobunaga's Ambition for SNES of late; the save feature doesn't work on the online emulator I found so actually winning the game is a long and difficult proposition; I managed to do it today for the 17 fief campaign.

I bring up Nobunaga because it could be played as a multi-player game, and it too utilizes a strategic overall campaign map and tactical maps of each of the fiefs during combat (and they're hex maps to boot). In this case, it was an eight-player game, and it was essentially cut-throat (i.e. every man for themselves). That game handled battles by stopping the action on the strategic level when a battle occurred and returning to it when the battle was concluded; of course, that meant everybody else had to wait while a player sat there and resolved his conflict. Probably as boring as it sounds...

I don't know how the game would work with a lot of players, unless (say) there was a "Grand Admiral" of the fleet for the Confederation (Space Marshal is probably the proper term there) and for the Kilrathi (a Kalralahr, unless I'm mistaken, which I'm pretty sure I am). In other words, you'd have two players whose job it would be to direct fleets around the strategic map, with each indidivual fleet under the control of another player whose job it is to make tactical decisions. If you then set it up so that the time scale of actions on the strategic map was the same as that of the tactical map, a fleet admiral could be involved in a battle while his colleagues are off doing there own thing.

Just thinking out loud here. Me, I'm seeing a lot of potential for the game on the strategic map, but that's drawing back to my own project and not the kind of help you said you needed.

Out of curiosity, does your project have a working name just yet?
 

Ron B

Master Chief Petty Officer
Sorry for the silence the last couple of days; things have been pretty hairy at work the last couple of days and I haven't had anytime to work on Elegy let alone anything else. I'm still thinking about how you'd handle Panzer General as a multi-player game; I found a PDF of the manual online over the weekend and have slowly been learning the ins and outs of the game. I've also been playing through Nobunaga's Ambition for SNES of late; the save feature doesn't work on the online emulator I found so actually winning the game is a long and difficult proposition; I managed to do it today for the 17 fief campaign.

I bring up Nobunaga because it could be played as a multi-player game, and it too utilizes a strategic overall campaign map and tactical maps of each of the fiefs during combat (and they're hex maps to boot). In this case, it was an eight-player game, and it was essentially cut-throat (i.e. every man for themselves). That game handled battles by stopping the action on the strategic level when a battle occurred and returning to it when the battle was concluded; of course, that meant everybody else had to wait while a player sat there and resolved his conflict. Probably as boring as it sounds...

I don't know how the game would work with a lot of players, unless (say) there was a "Grand Admiral" of the fleet for the Confederation (Space Marshal is probably the proper term there) and for the Kilrathi (a Kalralahr, unless I'm mistaken, which I'm pretty sure I am). In other words, you'd have two players whose job it would be to direct fleets around the strategic map, with each indidivual fleet under the control of another player whose job it is to make tactical decisions. If you then set it up so that the time scale of actions on the strategic map was the same as that of the tactical map, a fleet admiral could be involved in a battle while his colleagues are off doing there own thing.

Just thinking out loud here. Me, I'm seeing a lot of potential for the game on the strategic map, but that's drawing back to my own project and not the kind of help you said you needed.

Out of curiosity, does your project have a working name just yet?
Hi Capi, Great to hear from you again. Hope you are able to sort out your work issues (what do you do btw?). Thanks for giving this some thought. I have thought about the Nobunaga idea of freezing gameplay till combat is resolved but as you rightly pointed out, the rest of the players will get impatient or bored.

I was thinking along the same lines as your Grand Admiral idea. I was thinking team play so that if one player is missing the other can take over. The question arises that should we allow heirarchy or keep it a flat team. Do we let the players sort out command and control internally or do we force a structure on them. Who takes the call to end the turn for all of them? But so far this is the best idea that made sense. I really want it to be a large canvas game instead of a microscopic single games.

I hope you saw the screen shots I uploaded in my previous posts. Just to give you an update I am basing the game currently in the Gemini sector. I have added 65 systems maps and designated jump spots to each so that they are interconnected exactly as per the Gemini map. I still have to give the ships ability to jump but that won't be difficult. Soon the entire fleet will have mobility across all systems. Hopefully in the next 10-15 days I'll be able to upload a fully working test version for you to try out. Am really excited about that.

I am just calling it WC Generals for now.

Awaiting your feedback. Thanks for your time.
 

Maslas

Rear Admiral
a Hex based Turn based WC Universe war game in the style of the venerable Panzer General. Imagine Panzer General in the WC world.
You really turn me back to the days of great gaming experiences. I've always favoured turn based strategies than RTSs.
I love your sprites and I hope it will be cross platform (PC, MAC & LINUX).

Good luck with your project!
 

Ron B

Master Chief Petty Officer
You really turn me back to the days of great gaming experiences. I've always favoured turn based strategies than RTSs.
I love your sprites and I hope it will be cross platform (PC, MAC & LINUX).

Good luck with your project!
I am also nostalgic for the old days of the turn based strategy games and hence this project. Its going to be completely online browser based so OS should not matter. Thanks for your support.
 

capi3101

Rear Admiral
Had a number of ideas crop up for WC Generals this afternoon (while I was beating the snot out of Kitabatake playing Nobunaga again when I shouldn't have been). I'll go ahead and share them with you and see what you think about them. Hopefully nothing here is too far off from the spirit of Panzer General; my main concern was coming up with a solution for turning what was essentially a single-player game into one that could support twenty. I'll be kinda rambling here (i.e. I'll be typing this stuff up as I go), so I won't be editing myself. Lemme know if anything I say is confusing or needs clarification.

1) The game will have two sides - the Confederation (Terrans) and the Empire (Kilrathi). Each side will have up to ten controllable fleets stationed at various points around their respective empires at the game's onset, with fleet actions controlled by bots unless the given fleet is ultimately assigned to a player.

2) The game should be able to begin with a minimum of one player; this player is the "field marshal" that ultimately holds sway over the command actions of whichever side they choose (i.e. the field marshal). Other players may join the game as it progresses, either joining this first player as a team or electing to join the other side; the first player to select the other side automatically becomes that side's field marshal. A system of invites may be used to allow players to join a side, or it could simply be something done automatically.

2A) Alternatively, a group of players may elect to play the game together prior to the game's onset; the game will automatically select a field marshal from among the available candidates in this case.

3) When it comes to non-combat movement (i.e. a fleet travelling through an area that has no hostile forces or zones of control), the number of turns it takes to travel through that system to a destination system may be pre-determined (this on the notion that most capital ships in the WC universe travel no faster than about 100 kps). The end result is that all movement and fighting takes place on the same time scale.

4) Players have three minutes to commit their orders to the server; if all players commit prior to the end of that time limit, the server may commence with execution of orders at that point. If a player does not enter their orders in that time frame, their fleet performs no actions (or only actions that carry over from previous turns).

5) A player may elect to turn over control of their fleet to a bot if they so choose, selecting whether to allow other players to take control over their fleet or if they are simply taking a break and intend to resume control over the fleet at some point. When a player resumes control over the fleet, they will receive a report of the actions in which their fleet has been involved since the last time they took control.

5A) The field marshal may command more than one fleet at a time.

I guess that's expounding a bit on the ideas I had yesterday night. Anyways, I'll throw those out there and see what you think.
 

Ron B

Master Chief Petty Officer
Had a number of ideas crop up for WC Generals this afternoon (while I was beating the snot out of Kitabatake playing Nobunaga again when I shouldn't have been). I'll go ahead and share them with you and see what you think about them. Hopefully nothing here is too far off from the spirit of Panzer General; my main concern was coming up with a solution for turning what was essentially a single-player game into one that could support twenty. I'll be kinda rambling here (i.e. I'll be typing this stuff up as I go), so I won't be editing myself. Lemme know if anything I say is confusing or needs clarification.

1) The game will have two sides - the Confederation (Terrans) and the Empire (Kilrathi). Each side will have up to ten controllable fleets stationed at various points around their respective empires at the game's onset, with fleet actions controlled by bots unless the given fleet is ultimately assigned to a player.

2) The game should be able to begin with a minimum of one player; this player is the "field marshal" that ultimately holds sway over the command actions of whichever side they choose (i.e. the field marshal). Other players may join the game as it progresses, either joining this first player as a team or electing to join the other side; the first player to select the other side automatically becomes that side's field marshal. A system of invites may be used to allow players to join a side, or it could simply be something done automatically.

Ron - Agree. Its a good idea to allow upto 10 players per side. The first player can join with limited credits to create his first fleet. He can then assign ships to new players as they join breaking into multiple fleets. Command and control will have to be worked out. Every turn planets, mining facilities, refinarys, merchant ships will generate new credits with which the fleet can expand. This gives the players incentives to control more planets etc.

2A) Alternatively, a group of players may elect to play the game together prior to the game's onset; the game will automatically select a field marshal from among the available candidates in this case.

Ron - Yes. Starting credits will have to be calculated accordingly.

3) When it comes to non-combat movement (i.e. a fleet travelling through an area that has no hostile forces or zones of control), the number of turns it takes to travel through that system to a destination system may be pre-determined (this on the notion that most capital ships in the WC universe travel no faster than about 100 kps). The end result is that all movement and fighting takes place on the same time scale.

Ron - Will have to think about this.

4) Players have three minutes to commit their orders to the server; if all players commit prior to the end of that time limit, the server may commence with execution of orders at that point. If a player does not enter their orders in that time frame, their fleet performs no actions (or only actions that carry over from previous turns).

Ron - Will have to think about this.

5) A player may elect to turn over control of their fleet to a bot if they so choose, selecting whether to allow other players to take control over their fleet or if they are simply taking a break and intend to resume control over the fleet at some point. When a player resumes control over the fleet, they will receive a report of the actions in which their fleet has been involved since the last time they took control.

Ron - Designig bots that handle the fleet intelligently while the commander is away might be too difficult. Instead the fleet can remain dormant or be handled by a team player.

5A) The field marshal may command more than one fleet at a time.

I guess that's expounding a bit on the ideas I had yesterday night. Anyways, I'll throw those out there and see what you think.

Ron - I think an intelligent strategy is crystallizing. We will have to work out the kinks. Of course actual alpha and beta tests will also help.
Thanks so much for your feeback. My comments are in the quote space above.

I need some immediate help. I need a systemwise list of all planets, mining stations, refineries, bases etc in the Gemini sector. Can you help me with that?

Jump points are all set. Now I need to upload the other elements in each system.
 

capi3101

Rear Admiral
I need some immediate help. I need a systemwise list of all planets, mining stations, refineries, bases etc in the Gemini sector. Can you help me with that?
Absolutely - you're in luck here. I put just such a list in WCRPG, Chapter 8.5. They even have the extrapolated coordinates on a 100x100 grid, if that information would be of use to you.

Direct link to the data - http://wcrpg.wikia.com/wiki/8.5:_Navigational_Data#Available_Specific_System_Information

And I uploaded maps of each system in Gemini to WCPedia last year. Each individual system entry will have the maps as they appeared in Privateer
Gateway to the WCPedia Gemini entry - https://www.wcnews.com/wcpedia/Gemini_Sector
 
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Ron B

Master Chief Petty Officer
Absolutely - you're in luck here. I put just such a list in WCRPG, Chapter 8.5. They even have the extrapolated coordinates on a 100x100 grid, if that information would be of use to you.

Direct link to the data - http://wcrpg.wikia.com/wiki/8.5:_Navigational_Data#Available_Specific_System_Information

And I uploaded maps of each system in Gemini to WCPedia last year. Each individual system entry will have the maps as they appeared in Privateer
Gateway to the WCPedia Gemini entry - https://www.wcnews.com/wcpedia/Gemini_Sector
Amazing. Thanks. Remind me to name something after you. :)
 
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Ron B

Master Chief Petty Officer
Good progress!! Simulated an entire battle today. Still need to fine tune combat algorithm a bit but nice to see months work coming together so well.
To-do list is still quite long. Hope to open it up for testing by the end of the month. Cheers.
 

Ron B

Master Chief Petty Officer
Had a number of ideas crop up for WC Generals this afternoon (while I was beating the snot out of Kitabatake playing Nobunaga again when I shouldn't have been). I'll go ahead and share them with you and see what you think about them. Hopefully nothing here is too far off from the spirit of Panzer General; my main concern was coming up with a solution for turning what was essentially a single-player game into one that could support twenty. I'll be kinda rambling here (i.e. I'll be typing this stuff up as I go), so I won't be editing myself. Lemme know if anything I say is confusing or needs clarification.

1) The game will have two sides - the Confederation (Terrans) and the Empire (Kilrathi). Each side will have up to ten controllable fleets stationed at various points around their respective empires at the game's onset, with fleet actions controlled by bots unless the given fleet is ultimately assigned to a player.

2) The game should be able to begin with a minimum of one player; this player is the "field marshal" that ultimately holds sway over the command actions of whichever side they choose (i.e. the field marshal). Other players may join the game as it progresses, either joining this first player as a team or electing to join the other side; the first player to select the other side automatically becomes that side's field marshal. A system of invites may be used to allow players to join a side, or it could simply be something done automatically.

2A) Alternatively, a group of players may elect to play the game together prior to the game's onset; the game will automatically select a field marshal from among the available candidates in this case.

3) When it comes to non-combat movement (i.e. a fleet travelling through an area that has no hostile forces or zones of control), the number of turns it takes to travel through that system to a destination system may be pre-determined (this on the notion that most capital ships in the WC universe travel no faster than about 100 kps). The end result is that all movement and fighting takes place on the same time scale.

4) Players have three minutes to commit their orders to the server; if all players commit prior to the end of that time limit, the server may commence with execution of orders at that point. If a player does not enter their orders in that time frame, their fleet performs no actions (or only actions that carry over from previous turns).

5) A player may elect to turn over control of their fleet to a bot if they so choose, selecting whether to allow other players to take control over their fleet or if they are simply taking a break and intend to resume control over the fleet at some point. When a player resumes control over the fleet, they will receive a report of the actions in which their fleet has been involved since the last time they took control.

5A) The field marshal may command more than one fleet at a time.

I guess that's expounding a bit on the ideas I had yesterday night. Anyways, I'll throw those out there and see what you think.
How about this! Got the idea from Yahoo Gin of all places! We allow players to create games of 6 hour, 12 hour or 24 hour cycles. Whatever the duration set, everyones turn gets over after automatically in sequential order of joining the game in a fixed period of time alloted to them. If someone does not make the moves in his time window he gets decimated by the other players who have move and automatically loses. Let me know your thoughts.
 
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