Continuity

gryphon said:
"it's all a game, it's all fake, it's all made up, it's not important, people who spend more time and money on discussing games than the people who made them did making them are l00nee"

Ad hominem attacks ("l00nee") are hardly conducive to rational discussion... but quite acceptable in exchanges that sound like something I'd hear during recess, back when I was in the 1st grade (over 2 decades ago). They didn't sway me back then, either.

As for importance, then why are you throwing such a fuss because others aren't agreeing with you?
 
Hey gryphon, if it makes you feel better, I understand what you're saying and mostly agree with you. Although I'm not really sure what the last post was all about.

And until Chris Roberts writes a tell-all book that goes into all these timeline issues we all just believe whatever we want to. Which is fine with me. I may think that trying to get all things WC to coexist is a waste of time, but others would think some of things I do are a waste of time. So, basically, it doesn't bother me. Truthfully, I think it'll be interesting to see what people come up with, but utimately my opinion probably won't change.

All the quantum physics stuff went right over my head too. It sounded intelligent, and that's about all I comment on it. :)

Some personal advice for you Gryph: if there's someone on the forums you don't like, it's usually a good idea to just stay out of any topic they replied to, and if you started replying first, just ignore them (don't even bother reading their posts). Works for me.
 
What's to stop us from using the same techniques on Spot or Fluffy or any other animal? Once again, has nothing to do with being human.

Except that poor Spot and Fluffy won’t be the ones choosing and controlling their situation, will they? (As for the term, didn’t mean to sound like I was campaigning for it. Out of curiosity though, does “human nature” strike you the same way?)

. . . I know what I am talking about when I claim that Relativity and Quantum theory are not reconcilable. I'm sorry but no, You're wrong. . . . What physicists are attempting is to discover a quantum mechanical theory which matches the predictions of relativistic gravitational theory by using the principles of quantum electrodynamics and quantum gravity.

Hence . . . reconciliation! I just don’t see anything wrong in saying that and it certainly doesn’t undercut what you’ve described in greater detail. I very much respect that as a physicist you might be more circumspect, and would be more knowledgeable, about which descriptive terms fit best in a formal discussion, but I was talking informally (akin to any number of other physicists who have indeed spoken of “stitching together” or “unifying” the two theories), and my only aim was to undercut your analogy involving WC, which I did.:)

As for "normal science" working in the explanation of false predictions or otherwise erroneous data, this is simply not so.

My guess is you’re not as knowledgeable about the philosophy of science as you are about science or physics. Your statement is a fair description of the so-called static view, but it’s been pretty badly pummeled over the last several decades. And it’s safe to say that most historians of science would disagree with you too. (“Hey, buddy, can you paradigm?")

You say in your remark "reason we should disgregard the movie" - I made no such claim.

I think your intent was ambiguous until your latest posts. But I do happily agree with you that each person is free to embrace or reject the quest for canon. Still, if one chooses to embrace it, there are and must be certain constraints regarding how it is pursued. And an important one flows from . . .

I don't see the difference between Holding the Line and False Colors. Both were written by a human being with an interest in literature, focus on concepts outlined in the WC games, and are great pieces of literature. To make the point that one is more valid than the other just because person A wrote it and not person B is not logical.

But it is logical and necessary given that “person B” in this case is a licensee of EA/Origin. If one takes the idea of canon seriously, then it is simply not practical to have “multiple Gods” ruling the WC universe. The “reach” of the WC licensing rights is a most sensible measure of, and limit on, the “reality” of that universe.

Otherwise, the situation would be like . . . hmm, yes . . . the current state of string theory! Too many “solutions” to the equations. No wonder all this talk about canon vs. non-canon strikes a raw nerve.:)

I'll just sit here on my flat earth and concern myself with REAL physics. Lets see who's done the most worthwhile thing in 20 years.

For those who end up discovering, creating, enhancing, or at least sharing “good stories” about life, the universe, and everything, it’ll be a dead heat.
 
I really want to get right into the middle of this, but my time can be better spent on something else rather than trying to change the opinion of a physics researcher who can't handle facts backing up theories or imagine "outside the box" possiblities (yeah, good luck with that).
gryphon said:
So they're changing the universe. They did the same thing when they turned WC3 into Confed losing the war.
I'll go for one glaring point though. Didn't Fleet Action come out before/at the same time as WC3 which pretty accurately explains why Confed is losing the War in WC3.

C-ya
 
No man, no, see Fleet Action, that's a book, man, not a numbered WC game, so it's like, a totally different universe, man, that like, shares the name, and all the characters, and all the backstory, and everything else with the games, but is like, totally separate, you get what I'm saying, man? It's all a conspiracy, the Government... heh, the Government, they made deals with Aliens, see, man, and like, these Aliens, they want to suck out your brain, man, but first they have to...

HOLY SHIT THEY FOUND ME, I GOTTA GO!!!
 
Viper61 said:
I'll go for one glaring point though. Didn't Fleet Action come out before/at the same time as WC3 which pretty accurately explains why Confed is losing the War in WC3.

C-ya

The Victory Streak's history of the war ends with the false armistice and Battle of Terra, though it is referred to as "the attack on Earth."
 
Cameras do not steal souls... RETAIL JOBS STEAL SOULS.
Anyway, I could banter on for weeks about the inconsistencies between the movie and the games... ahh hell, I'm bored... let's go over a few.
1. Tiger's Claw-Tiger Claw
- both referred to as Blair's first tour of duty.
- Blair's plot direction with the Tiger Claw takes him to Sol system, to prevent an invasion.
- Blairs plot direction with the Tiger's Claw takes him far from Sol system, to destroy a Kilrathi Space Station.
Pretty big discrepancy there.
2. Pilgrim "truth."
- We hear NOTHING about this "Pilgrim War" anywhere else in the universe, with the exception of the movie and related books/scripts. Nor do we hear of Pilgrims in general.

I like the movie, but quite frankly, I can't count it as "canon," just because we're all so desperate for it to fit. That would be like slapping the transmission from a Yugo into a Porche and screaming, "Hey, they're both European cars! It'll work!" It doesn't fit, and no amount of banter or speculation will fix it.
 
Most of your points are really really idiotic, though...

Since the Tiger's Claw is the same ship as the Tiger Claw, it's not odd that they're both where Blair is in 2654... Since the movie takes place a short while before the first game, it's not odd in any way that he's doing two different things at two different times...

To continue on with your points, after the first game I don't believe we ever hear of the Mopoks again! Wing Commander 2 is obviously, therefore, in a different universe altogether!

Wait... no

This would only be a contradiction if someone were to, for some reason, say:

"Hey Chris, you know what doesn't exist? Pilgrims!"

or something of the sort... Either way, all the Pilgrims have gone away, and there isn't really any reason to bring it up in discussion. The only time human religion is *ever* brought up later in the series that I can recall is regarding the Retros, who you are actively fighting, and during the Christmas stuff in False Colors.
 
Nemesis said:
Out of curiosity though, does “human nature” strike you the same way?

First off, I wasn't accusing you of anything. Sorry if it sounded that way dude.

That strikes me just fine. In that case "human" just serves to explain who's nature we're talking about. It's not some entire other concept away from "nature." It's interchangeable with "nature" or "it's only natural." Both can be said about any other animal.

Frosty said:
HOLY SHIT THEY FOUND ME, I GOTTA GO!!!

The MLB is after us all Frosty. Be carefull out there. ;)

TC said:
This would only be a contradiction if someone were to, for some reason, say:

"Hey Chris, you know what doesn't exist? Pilgrims!"

Well, they don't exist..... anymore. :p
 
1. Tiger's Claw-Tiger Claw
- both referred to as Blair's first tour of duty.

Oh no! Blair's first tour of duty was on the Tiger's Claw... and also... the Tiger's Claw?! I can't figure out the connection! Help!

(This, of course, ignores the fact that neither source claims that the Tiger's Claw was his first assignment - he had previously served on the Formidable, the Waterloo and lectured at the Academy...)

- Blair's plot direction with the Tiger Claw takes him to Sol system, to prevent an invasion.
- Blairs plot direction with the Tiger's Claw takes him far from Sol system, to destroy a Kilrathi Space Station.
Pretty big discrepancy there.

The movie takes place several months before WC1. Three months ago I was in Atlanta. A month ago I was in Austin. Next month I'll be in Paris. Which parts of my life exist?

To continue on with your points, after the first game I don't believe we ever hear of the Mopoks again! Wing Commander 2 is obviously, therefore, in a different universe altogether!

It's still a sensible argument, but it's worth pointing out that Mopoks are mentioned in the Prophecy manual.
 
Bandit LOAF said:
It's still a sensible argument, but it's worth pointing out that Mopoks are mentioned in the Prophecy manual.

What is a *Mopok*? Kind of a Pilgrim or what?
 
Murray said:
What is a *Mopok*? Kind of a Pilgrim or what?

Heh. Little red cavemen with sticks holding armored Kilrathi hostage...

Yup. Gotta love how wimpy those Kilrathi Marines were on the winning path. :D
 
Bandit LOAF said:
The little red guys who capture some Kilrathi marines in WC1.

Man, I miss my Amiga. Can't remember any of this stuff from WC1. And I was 16 when I played WC1. Gotta have bad memory :rolleyes:
 
Back
Top