Ladiesman^
Spaceman
.....and saved the lives of (millions? billions?) in the process.......
It seems acceptable to me that the Eisen is a Vesuvius. I haven't seen any particularly convincing arguements as to why it wouldn't be.
Classification of TCS Eisen
- Thread starter Dragonslayer
- Start date
.....and saved the lives of (millions? billions?) in the process.......
It seems acceptable to me that the Eisen is a Vesuvius. I haven't seen any particularly convincing arguements as to why it wouldn't be.
Only problem with that is that the Eisen is still operating Vampires after the squadron is transferred to the Midway, which means that the Eisen has its own squadron of Vampires. Said Vampires fly support using a WW kit.
So if the Eisen has Vampires, and Vampires are only assigned to Heavy Carriers, then the Eisen must be a Heavy Carrier. And since the Eisen was almost certainly built post-WC4, its almost guaranteed to be a Vesuvius.
Bandit LOAF
Long Live the Confederation!
Plus, there's a *reason* escort carriers have lighter craft -- because they have smaller flight decks. The Tarawa had to have specially modified Sabres and couldn't carry Broadswords at all...
I don't see why. THe Midway's are replacing the fleet carriers but not yet. The Fleet carriers would still be in action until there were enough Midways to take over the role. It seems this thread is saying that there are only Vesuvius and Midway class carriers in the Confed Navy circa Prophecy. I don't agree. There is tons of Confed space to patrol, and plus when one craft is designed to replace another, that doesn't mean the replaced craft is immediately scrapped and not used(take the F/A-18 replacing the A-6 - correct me if I'm wrong on that). I'd still have to say the Eisen is a post-WC4 fleet/heavy carrier that the Midway class is "replacing" (thereby probably making these carriers into not-exactly-light-carriers).
Though I do agree that the arguement that a Vesuvius should be named Eisen (after his escapade in WC4) and you can only have so many Volcanoes that blew their tops
.C-ya
No, the Midway and Vesuvius classes are not the only fleet carriers in service at the time, but they are the only NEW fleet carriers at the time--it is unlikely that Confed would be implementing another brand-new class of heavy fleet carriers since they are planning on mass-producing the Midways so soon. If the Eisen is not a new carrier built in the post-WC4 period (which would likely make it a Vesuvius as we have been speculating), then it would probably be a refitted and renamed Concordia or Bengal class carrier.
You know the whole "It's old so we'll replace it with the Midway" thing is complete bull. All the Midway is good for is launching fighters, its no good at killing cap ships. Maybe they built a new class of medium carrier, to fill the gap between the Hades and Midway? I would.
Also, if the Cerberus is the first of a new class why is it a Hades class?
Also, if the Cerberus is the first of a new class why is it a Hades class?
Capn Johnny
Cap'n Johnny
The TCS Eisen was a Vesuvious class carrier.
We never decided whether it was a newly constucted ship, or an existing (still fairly new) Vesuvious class CV that had been renamed in honor of the recently deceased confederation hero.
I could almost swear you got to see the Eisen in WCP at some point.. but its been soo long, I could be wrong.
-Johnny
We never decided whether it was a newly constucted ship, or an existing (still fairly new) Vesuvious class CV that had been renamed in honor of the recently deceased confederation hero.
I could almost swear you got to see the Eisen in WCP at some point.. but its been soo long, I could be wrong.
-Johnny
Capn Johnny
Cap'n Johnny
The Hades never entered full service. It was mainly a testbed for technolgies that would be used in later ships, yet it was in fact the first ship in the class.
-Johnny
Ghost
Emperor
They Have the Plunkett (Cruiser) and the Murphy (Destroyer) for Capship VS Capship battles, the Midway is a mobile base in peacetime, in wartime she needs escort (Cruisers,Dest,etc)
The TCS Hades was the first ship of her,therefore the name of the class, maybe she was only a test ship, but i can´t remember where it was written or said that the Cerberus was the first of her class.
I'm thinkin...
Spaceman
The opening scene of Secret Ops begins with a presentaion by a senator talking about taking possession of Cerberus, Bartok Designs FIRST quick strike assault crusier. Although it does seem odd that it wasn't named Hades, being it was the first ship in its class
So we are saying that the only carriers still in service from and being produced from the end of WC4 to WCP (what is that, 10-15 years?) are the Vesuvius-class? That would put a major hole in the operational effeciency of the fleet. The war with the Kilrathi is over, why wait 10-15 years to start replacing your fleet carriers? That seems very ineffecient in the way the new Confed ran things after the Kilrathi War (effeciency reports, rank pass-over, etc). And before we start the wholw "it takes that long to design, test and, build a carrier" routine, why wouldn't Confed have plans during the Kilrathi War for new Carriers (they appartenly had a new line of fleet carriers coming on line at the end of End Run).
So to make a long story shorter (too late), I still don't understand why Confed would just stop producing their wartime/post-wartime carriers to just concentrate on building Vesuvius-class vessels. If they didn't, then why is it not logical that the Eisen could have been a heavy Fleet carrier designed during/at the end/or just after the Kilrathi War that Confed produced until after WC4 and designated one the TCS Eisen after he retired. I think it holds about as much water as saying that the Eisen is a Vesuvius class carrier.
Oh by the way, it is said that the Vampire flies from only heavy carriers, I was just curious to what this limitation is based on (and don't tell me the ICIS manual, I'm looking for a logical reason). I mean the Vampire isn't a large fighter by any means the way a devastator is, I don't think it's that much more advanced than the Panther, just a diffent design on the same principle. So why limit the Vampire to only heavy carriers? There are exceptions to every rule.
C-ya
It's possible that in the time between WC4 and Prophecy Confed may have built another Fleet Carrier class other than the Vesuvius. If this were the case, I'd go out on a limb, and say that it wouldn't be as big, but still large enough to carry all the newer heavy fighter/bomber classes. The new class would probably not incorporate all the developments of the Vesuvious class for the sake of rapid production, and lower cost.
I would guess that Vesuvious class vessels would take a very long time to build, and require quite a lot of money. As such, Confed might want to desighn something more along the lines of a Concordia class, but with substantial improvements. Also, after narrowly surviving a 40 year long war, I would hope tha ConFleet would have learned not to hang all it's hopes on one class of really big ship.
As for the naming of the TCS Eisen, it was stated in a WC4 cutscene, that Eisen was a grandfather, that places him as "advanced in his years." It is quite possible that he died of old age, or some freak shuttle accident in the intervening years. Or the ship was named for another Eisen. A ship in the US navy may be named after a living person (Bob Hope, Ron Reagan), but not after a serving line officer.
I would guess that Vesuvious class vessels would take a very long time to build, and require quite a lot of money. As such, Confed might want to desighn something more along the lines of a Concordia class, but with substantial improvements. Also, after narrowly surviving a 40 year long war, I would hope tha ConFleet would have learned not to hang all it's hopes on one class of really big ship.
As for the naming of the TCS Eisen, it was stated in a WC4 cutscene, that Eisen was a grandfather, that places him as "advanced in his years." It is quite possible that he died of old age, or some freak shuttle accident in the intervening years. Or the ship was named for another Eisen. A ship in the US navy may be named after a living person (Bob Hope, Ron Reagan), but not after a serving line officer.
Bandit LOAF
Long Live the Confederation!
That's quite possible, but this wouldn't fit with the requirement that the Eisen be a heavy fleet carrier which mounts multiple fighter wings... The indication in the ICIS manual is that Confed uses dedicated escort carriers for smaller actions.
There are some limitations imposed on carrier production spoken of in the novels, which explain why Confed produces only a carrier or two each year instead of a billion of them...
- It takes ten years to produce a new carrier shipyard.
- It takes five years to tool a shipyard up to produce a new class of carrier.
Fighting the Kilrathi meant that shipyards were destroyed as quickly as they could be produced... so we didn't have a huge stream of new carriers at some point. If we could jump to fifteen years after the war ended maybe we could start to see a surge in weird new carriers (of course, this doesn't count time to *design* a new class of carriers -- that took something like ten years in the case of the Cerberus...)
Even if Confed *did* have another carrier that fulfilled the same purpose as the Concordia-class, it wouldn't really make sense for it to be a Vesuvius. The ICIS manual specifically gives Vampires to *heavy* fleet carriers (which the Concordia-class is not), and the game would certainly imply that Eisen carries *multiple* wings of fighters -- since she gives Midway the Wolfpack and then moves *ahead* of her to fight the bugs.
Confed *was* presumably working on a new class of carrier during the war... the Vesuvius.
There were only eight years between Wing 4 and Prophecy (2673 to 2681).
Well, it wasn't really their *choice* to stop producing war era carriers -- the Kilrathi whacked the hell out of their shipyards in 2668...
As we see in End Run, a carriers deck size limits what classes of fighters it can carry -- the Tarawa couldn't carry Broadswords, for instance.
Here's SO fiction that says otherwise: http://www.secretops.com/episodes/1_1b_d_icis.html . The Hades was the test ship.