Wraith?
- Thread starter F4U Corsair
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Maj.Striker
Swabbie
Banned
Sorry to go on another tangent but talking about Armada brings up great memories for me. I thought it was an absolutely incredible game that didn't win as much hype as I felt it deserved.
Well, If you play Armada on anything higher than the basic level it can be quite challenging. I remember long frustrating moments of Kilrathi ships doing endless loops of wild turns and you'd spin to just barely get them in your target reticule only to have them spin away again. Fortunately, (or at least the way it seemed to me) after long periods of these spinning battles the AI would recognized that your blood pressure was high enough to blow out your ears and would "dumb" down the enemy fighters and they wouldn't be quite as maneuverable and allow you to take them down. I'd need Loaf or someone more familar with the game to comment on that but it seemed to me (especially fighting the Jathreks) that after a long time if you were still tangling with one it would eventually slow down for you to hit them.
Well, If you play Armada on anything higher than the basic level it can be quite challenging. I remember long frustrating moments of Kilrathi ships doing endless loops of wild turns and you'd spin to just barely get them in your target reticule only to have them spin away again. Fortunately, (or at least the way it seemed to me) after long periods of these spinning battles the AI would recognized that your blood pressure was high enough to blow out your ears and would "dumb" down the enemy fighters and they wouldn't be quite as maneuverable and allow you to take them down. I'd need Loaf or someone more familar with the game to comment on that but it seemed to me (especially fighting the Jathreks) that after a long time if you were still tangling with one it would eventually slow down for you to hit them.
Quarto
Unknown Enemy
Hehe, it wasn't the AI being dumbed down - the enemy ships simply used afterburners a lot more than the average player does, and so would eventually run out of fuel. This was particularly important with the Arrows.
ELTEE
Vice Admiral
Well, as I remember it, Voices of War doesn't give a specific class name for the Kilrathi carrier used in Armada. I got my information on that ship from tactics.solsector.net; so I'll be the first to admit that it could be wrong. That site displays the picture of the correct carrier and calls it a "Snakeir II" class. Since the site agreed with other sources about the Lexington CVN, I'll admit I took the information on the Kilrathi carrier at face value...
Bandit LOAF
Long Live the Confederation!
Fleet Tactics isn't the most reliable website in the universe.
Basically, we just don't know anything about the Armada fighters. People have a lot of elaborate theories... but they aren't really based on any kind of source material. Armada was designed as a bridge, of sorts, and that should be clear from the fighters -- they include the newest designs from the previous generation of games (Wraith and Jrathek) and then the first designs that will be carried over into the next game (Dralthi and Arrow).
Also, I don't think Wing Commander has a 'CVN' designation.
Basically, we just don't know anything about the Armada fighters. People have a lot of elaborate theories... but they aren't really based on any kind of source material. Armada was designed as a bridge, of sorts, and that should be clear from the fighters -- they include the newest designs from the previous generation of games (Wraith and Jrathek) and then the first designs that will be carried over into the next game (Dralthi and Arrow).
Also, I don't think Wing Commander has a 'CVN' designation.
Death
gh0d (Administrator)
Seeing as the "N" of "CVN" denotes a nuclear-powered carrier, and WC capships use matter/antimatter powerplants, I kinda doubt the designation "CVN" be of much use in ConFleet.
ELTEE
Vice Admiral
Good point about CVN. I know that I read that designation for that particular class of carrier somewhere; I just can't remember where. And yes, I had similar thoughts about it. I remember coming accross it on a site that also explained the history of the Confederation class TCS Concordia. I remember being surprised that according to this source, anyway, Confed only chose CVS at the last minute, owing to the realization that the fighter carrying capability was more important than the capability of the ship mounted primary weapon.
Hmm, well, I know you will all laugh at me, but Wikipedia for one lists that particular class as CVN. I guess we should edit that!
I still read it on another site somewhere else though...
I agree, however, that CVN does appear to be silly, considering what it stands for today.
I think my problem is that I have, as of late, been rediscovering the Wing Commander universe and so I am hungry for information. It is sometimes difficult I find to evaluate sources of information for any topic, even more so for a topic like Wing Commander. Can anyone offer any suggestions for good wing commander sources? I know that question is broad, but I'm guessing that most here can easily come up with a top five.
Hmm, well, I know you will all laugh at me, but Wikipedia for one lists that particular class as CVN. I guess we should edit that!
I still read it on another site somewhere else though...I agree, however, that CVN does appear to be silly, considering what it stands for today.
I think my problem is that I have, as of late, been rediscovering the Wing Commander universe and so I am hungry for information. It is sometimes difficult I find to evaluate sources of information for any topic, even more so for a topic like Wing Commander. Can anyone offer any suggestions for good wing commander sources? I know that question is broad, but I'm guessing that most here can easily come up with a top five.
Death
gh0d (Administrator)
Your source sounds like he or she is pulling shit out of his ass and trying to sell it to you as a fancy meal. There is absolutely zero official mention of the decision process that lead to the CVS designation used on Confederation-class dreadnoughts, nevermind anything like a history aside from what's in the games and novels.
As for Fleet Tactics, there's a disclaimer link on their main page specifically stating that their work is not to be cited as official, regardless of what research was put into any particular matter.
Also, citing Wikipedia as a source for anything, WC or otherwise, leaves you open to people laughing at you, especially on this board, where several regular participants aren't exactly shy about their opinions regarding Wiki's lack of accuracy.
(Like, say, yours truly.
)
For official stuff, your best starting point is searching the links along the right side of the WC CIC main page.
As for Fleet Tactics, there's a disclaimer link on their main page specifically stating that their work is not to be cited as official, regardless of what research was put into any particular matter.
Also, citing Wikipedia as a source for anything, WC or otherwise, leaves you open to people laughing at you, especially on this board, where several regular participants aren't exactly shy about their opinions regarding Wiki's lack of accuracy.
(Like, say, yours truly.
)For official stuff, your best starting point is searching the links along the right side of the WC CIC main page.
Bandit LOAF
Long Live the Confederation!
We can probably help you with any questions more than any one website.
Fleet Tactics is something of an oddity, obscure disclaimer aside. It's the kind of thing that seems like a good idea when you're doing it and then is terribly embarassing later on. For example, you noticed the Confederation-class backstory. The webmaster decided, sight unseen, that he didn't like the fact that the Concordia was 'CVS' while other carriers were 'CV'... and invented an elaborate backstory to 'explain' this 'problem'. It's fanon -- pointless answers to questions no one actually asked.
If you're interested in Wing Commander material, though, the best place to start is the game manuals -- Claw Marks, Voices of War and Victory Streak are the real goldmines. Then there's a variety of novels, official guides, TV episodes, game scripts and so forth that will build the background of the universe as we usually discuss it.
Fleet Tactics is something of an oddity, obscure disclaimer aside. It's the kind of thing that seems like a good idea when you're doing it and then is terribly embarassing later on. For example, you noticed the Confederation-class backstory. The webmaster decided, sight unseen, that he didn't like the fact that the Concordia was 'CVS' while other carriers were 'CV'... and invented an elaborate backstory to 'explain' this 'problem'. It's fanon -- pointless answers to questions no one actually asked.
If you're interested in Wing Commander material, though, the best place to start is the game manuals -- Claw Marks, Voices of War and Victory Streak are the real goldmines. Then there's a variety of novels, official guides, TV episodes, game scripts and so forth that will build the background of the universe as we usually discuss it.
ELTEE
Vice Admiral
Thanks LOAF; your post seemed a bit more forgiving
I remembered where I found that garbage info...I'm embarrassed even more now because it wasn't a real Wing Commander site. For some reason, I just latched onto the crap. I must have been bored at work and started reading the text without really checking what it was!
http://www.kitsune.addr.com/SF-Conv...s/Confederation_Confederation_Dreadnought.htm
I actually have every manual except the KS version and the original Academy; I remember thinking even as a young kid that they were the best game manuals I had ever come accross, so thankfully I saved them along with the rest of the WC materials.
I think I have heard mention of a "confederation handbook." Should this be something I look into also?
I remembered where I found that garbage info...I'm embarrassed even more now because it wasn't a real Wing Commander site. For some reason, I just latched onto the crap. I must have been bored at work and started reading the text without really checking what it was!
http://www.kitsune.addr.com/SF-Conv...s/Confederation_Confederation_Dreadnought.htm
I actually have every manual except the KS version and the original Academy; I remember thinking even as a young kid that they were the best game manuals I had ever come accross, so thankfully I saved them along with the rest of the WC materials.
I think I have heard mention of a "confederation handbook." Should this be something I look into also?
Bandit LOAF
Long Live the Confederation!
It's a common mistake. Fleet Tactics seems like a compelling resource because it promises interesting information that doesn't seem to be avaialble anywhere else... it just turns out that there's an obvious reason for that.
I believe that both the Kilrathi Saga and Academy manuals are archived at the CIC. You can find them here: https://www.wcnews.com/manuals.shtml
They're both among the better booklets. Academy has nice little descriptions for all of the WC2 ships (plus a few others), and the Kilrathi Saga manual is literally a 'scrap book' that includes things from Claw Marks, Victory Streak and newly created material to bridge the two.
The Confederation Handbook is basically 'Claw Marks' for the Wing Commander movie. A lot of people can't get over the fact that the movie wasn't very good and want to reject it entirely. At the end of the day, though, it's pretty cool that they got the same guys who did the game manuals to write a sourcebook for it. I would personally argue that even if you overlook the movie entirely, the Handbook is pretty neat... it's something that adds a lot of background to the WC universe.
I believe that both the Kilrathi Saga and Academy manuals are archived at the CIC. You can find them here: https://www.wcnews.com/manuals.shtml
They're both among the better booklets. Academy has nice little descriptions for all of the WC2 ships (plus a few others), and the Kilrathi Saga manual is literally a 'scrap book' that includes things from Claw Marks, Victory Streak and newly created material to bridge the two.
The Confederation Handbook is basically 'Claw Marks' for the Wing Commander movie. A lot of people can't get over the fact that the movie wasn't very good and want to reject it entirely. At the end of the day, though, it's pretty cool that they got the same guys who did the game manuals to write a sourcebook for it. I would personally argue that even if you overlook the movie entirely, the Handbook is pretty neat... it's something that adds a lot of background to the WC universe.
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