Bandit LOAF
Long Live the Confederation!
Yes, but only in the same sense that that talking dog on PBS is a reasonable substitute for reading classic literature.
Which Wing Commander game have you played the least?
- Thread starter -danr-
- Start date
Yes, but only in the same sense that that talking dog on PBS is a reasonable substitute for reading classic literature.
frostytheplebe
Seventh Part of the Seal
Ok good point.
ChrisReid
Super Soaker Collector / Administrator
That kind of thing is extremely hard to quantify. It's certainly a tremendous powerhouse. Shields of a Broadsword, but armor of a typical medium fighter. Significantly faster than anything you could fly up to that point. The Reaper Cannons were very very powerful. Crazy new Leech missiles.
Then we fly almost an identical Wraith in Armada and it does a good job of filling the medium fighter role, but other ships outclass it in speed/armament/etc.
There's a case for it being the best, but it's basically the WC2 version of the same case people make for the Rapier/Raptor, Excalibur and Dragon.
Sharpshooter
Rear Admiral
Ah, thanks. Quarto said a while ago that "nothing was ever as unbalanced as the Academy Wraith" (EDIT : whoops, it was Eder, actually), which is why I asked. Since I felt WC2 lacked a superfighter, I'm sure flying the Wraith will be an interesting experience.
Quarto
Unknown Enemy
The Wraith was amazing, above all, thanks to its speed. Its other stats were excellent, but it was the top speed that made you go "whoa!". The only other fighter that came close to matching it was (for obvious reasons) the Jrathek. The Wraith & Jrathek are rather unique because they were literally never matched* in the entire series - in terms of speed, they weren't just superfighters in Academy, they were the best superfighters seen in the entire series. If a Wraith were to appear onboard the Midway in 2681, it would still be the fastest (though the Vampire could match it if it redirected most of its power towards the engines). Not that this would help it much, since even a Piranha could easily gun it down.
*Except for Armada. But the difference between the Wraith & Jrathek and the other Armada ships is that you could go up against regular WC2 ships with them. The Arrow, Dralthi and Gladius, on the other hand, even when they appeared in other games, had their top speeds reduced to match regular ships.
*Except for Armada. But the difference between the Wraith & Jrathek and the other Armada ships is that you could go up against regular WC2 ships with them. The Arrow, Dralthi and Gladius, on the other hand, even when they appeared in other games, had their top speeds reduced to match regular ships.
It's a shame that Origin didn't re-use more ships as the series went on, it always seemed a bit of a shame that for each new Wing Commander release the shipsets had almost always completely changed - except (loosely) the Rapier in WC1/WC2 and some of the WC3 ships appearing in WC4.
If I were to change one thing about Wing Commander it would be that both the Terrans and Kilrathi saw ships that survived to be in each installment - the Kilrathi war showed humanity at full stretch, desperate for resources and needing to improvise - you'd think some of the old fighters would have hung on.
Standoff kinda changes this in a good way because it's 2668 and we're still flying Rapiers, Sabres, etc - but I would personally go one further and integrate them alongside Arrows, Excals etc on the Terran side too.
Chaosbringer
Rear Admiral
I don't know if it is because i'm more accustomed to other ships, but even in a ferret i do better performances than in a wraith, i just feel unconfortable in that ship (it may be just me).
Sharpshooter
Rear Admiral
Both the "regular" Ferret and the "Super" Ferret are very powerful, though - possibly my favorite WC2 ships. If I manage to do better in a Wraith than in a Ferret, then I'll really be impressed.
Quarto
Unknown Enemy
Now, really, if you think about this a bit more, I think you'll find that lack of recycling is the exception, not the rule. There are only two WC games that make a complete and utter break from the past - WCP and Privateer 2. WCP takes place many years after the last game (and includes references to older ships, like the manual's recon Excaliburs, the Tigershark's Hellcat heritage, etc.), and Priv 2 takes place in complete isolation to the rest of the universe. Even WC3, which you mentioned as not recycling anything, had reused the Arrow and Dralthi from Armada.
The trouble with that is that even if WC3 did use the Arrow from Armada, overall there was a really, really strong break in visual design. It's easy to explain away Thunderbolts flying around with Rapiers and such - but there's no way to put them together on the same screenshot. Standoff does make use of the Arrow - and really, that's the only Confed ship from WC3 that doesn't look terrible alongside the WC1/2 ships.
I see your point, and tentatively agree, but I maintain that it might have made for a better gaming experience, for true fans, if there had been a few more 'cameos' from the older craft in the main series. I know it would have been extra data for Origin to fit into the package just for the occasional encounter with an old craft, but I think overall worth it. WC3 I think could have done with just one more ship on each side from a bygone era, as the Arrow had only featured in a sub-game. Perhaps some FMV with a quick shot of some Rapiers or the like. This is easy for me to say from my chair as somebody with no knowledge of game production
Certainly can't criticise you for this, the contrast in ship design between the WC3 platform and either of its predecessors was deep. The variation in ship design aside, would certainly be interesting to see what the WC3 models would look like in the Standoff format, guess it might highlight how well they don't fit in.
frostytheplebe
Seventh Part of the Seal
Don't forget the Concordia makes a (brief) appearance as well! But I agree with your choice of the fighter, although I think you might have been able to get away with the hellcat V as well... GLAD YOU DIDNT! But you might have been able to.
ELTEE
Vice Admiral
Ha - yeah. Connie was going for a late afternoon swim...
frostytheplebe
Seventh Part of the Seal
Dyret
Super Carrot!
I see your point, and tentatively agree, but I maintain that it might have made for a better gaming experience, for true fans, if there had been a few more 'cameos' from the older craft in the main series. I know it would have been extra data for Origin to fit into the package just for the occasional encounter with an old craft, but I think overall worth it. WC3 I think could have done with just one more ship on each side from a bygone era, as the Arrow had only featured in a sub-game. Perhaps some FMV with a quick shot of some Rapiers or the like. This is easy for me to say from my chair as somebody with no knowledge of game production
True fans and sub-games? Wow.
Oh, and I forgot Academy; I played it for years before I even knew about the rest of the series, so that's actually the game I've played the most for sure.
frostytheplebe
Seventh Part of the Seal
True fans and sub-games? Wow.
Oh, and I forgot Academy; I played it for years before I even knew about the rest of the series, so that's actually the game I've played the most for sure.
Yeah thats a bit off the deep end to me as well. Personally WC3 had enough fighters as it was. WC4 had a ton too (flyable and otherwise).
Standoff... I love you guys, but you're out of your minds
Bandit LOAF
Long Live the Confederation!
It's a game that has to be considered in a particular perspective.
Academy was actually revolutionary in one way -- and it's a part of the story we don't think about very often, but one that may well continue to affect us today. In 1992, Origin's sales team made a fortune with a new approach that seems very simple today: they sold distributor's 'discount' copies of the previous cycle of games (Ultima VI and Wing Commander I). 'Discount' in 1992 meant $40 -- half the MSRP of a regular game. The program was a huge hit... Origin sold off their old stock, they turned a great profit and they boosted the install base for their big name series' significantly. Academy was an outgrowth of that. The idea was that it was the first time a big company had developed an original 'discount' ($40) game.
I think we also tend to think more slightly of the Wing Commander I/II engine games today. In consdering Academy we should remember that the actual combat was a bigger deal at the time. It was the equivalent to whatever the modern state-of-the-art 3D FPS is... the height of the experience. Also, expectations were a lot lower at the time regarding new content. We were pretty darned impressed with the new guns -- they doubled the number available to that point! And two new fighters, with cockpits? That was like buying two Special Ops addon packages!
The problem is varying definitions of 'true fans'. Today we love all this continuity... but back then the vast majority of hardcore Wing Commander fans were chomping at the bit for *new* stuff.
Captain Obvious
Rear Admiral
Prophecy and 4 are my least played. 1 and 2 are my most played.
ChrisReid
Super Soaker Collector / Administrator
You also have to look at it from the perspective of 1994 - people are begging to fly and see new ships. Then there is also the token cameo(s) that virtually every game has, like Quarto mentioned. And then look beyond 1994 - more than a dozen ships in WC3 were used in later games.