Originally posted by Terrorizer
They are technically not "meant to be together".
The point is that they are. Obviously in a universe that contains so many things, made by so many different people, there are bound to be mistakes, and in some cases like the movie where CR wanted to add new things, it would contradict with some stuff, but the movie DOES fit in with the rest of the universe fairly well with the exception of few things (like Bossman being already dead). But I don't think Chris Roberts ever meant to start the universe from scratch, he was just loking to add to it.
"Everything in the Confed Handbook follows RELIGIOUSLY from the continuity of the MOVIE. However, that continuity is deliberately, extensively and consistantly DIFFERENT from the continuity of the games."
Notice McCubbin said "deliberately". This is because Chris Roberts was trying to create another continuity separate from the games. There were even licensing restrictions on what could be used in the movie from the games.
As someone who has read the Confed Handbook, I can honestly say that McCubbin, didn't have to change many of the dates that he put in in the Confed Handbook...
And like I stated above, I don't think CR would want to do anything but to add to the universe that was already so large.
The wc4 novel only contained nitpicky details like the separation of the flight decks on the Lexington. The books fit with the games, because they were made using the games as a reference.
Nope, there are many difference between the WC4 novel and game, certainly too many to list them all. At any case, the flight deck example is flawed, because the game engine wouldn't be able to show the flight deck as it really should have looked like.
The fact that pilgrims never came up in any other wc story is enough for me, and many others.
May I ask why the Pilgrims should be mentioned at all? We only see small parts of the lives of the main characters in the games. In WC4 for example, you might see Vagabond and Blair talking about the current conflict between Confed and UBW, why would anyone mention Pilgrims? Why should they be mention anywhere in WC3, or WC2 (The only place where I see Pilgrims being mentioned, is when Tolwyn was talking with Blair in the intro)? In WC1, there isn't that much dialog about what's going on outside the Claw anyway.
It just changes everything about Blair. I liked the fact that he was just a regular farmer boy who grew up flying cropdusters, and grew up to end a horrible war. The movie credits this with his pilgrim heritage and abilities and dissproves the fact that a regular man can do incredible things.
Just because he's half Pilgrim doesn't mean that flying and combat skills would come easily to him. He even had to work harder than anyone else because of his heritage. Constantly having to prove himself, fighting the prejidice from everyone around him. In the movie, the minute Blair steped on the bridge of the Claw, Gerald was all over his heritage, already beliving that he wasn't competent. Blair is so good because he always had to try harder, make less mistakes, not because his mother had some genetic mutations.
So see, the movie doesn't tell us that Blair is some superhuman. It actually explains us why Blair grew up to be such a great warrior, and gives us an sample of all the things he had to overcome. The movie enhances the fact that a man can do extraordinary things, instead of destroying it...
Whether or not the stories were meant to fit together or not, I still believe they don't belong together. You can think whatever you want about the continuity of the wc Universe, that's your opinion.
But that's probably because you don't know many things about the universe.
Seriously though, I'd be happy to discuss with you different parts of the movie, and why they should or should not fit in the universe. If you want to, feel free to e-mail me, since this board has seen far to many discussions about the movie and a new one is not needed.
Meanwhile, I'll leave you all with the history of the Pilgrims taken from the Confed Handbook. It might show some people why the movie fits in (at least in some places).
The Pilgrim Alliance
The Pilgrim Alliance was the first organized effort by humanity to colonize other solar systems. Between 2311 and 2588 they colonized 12 systems in Sol and Vega sectors, using hopper-drive "sloships". Radical religous separatists, the Pilgrims belived that they were the "elect" of humanity, with the exclusive divine right to live outside the Sol system. In 2631 a Pilgrim fleet attacked the Terran Confederation Port of Titan starbase in an attempt to cripple Confed colonization efforts. Over the next four years the resulting conflict brought about the end of the Alliance. In 2635 the Pilgrim Alliance was formally dissolved, and all extant Pilgrim worlds were brought into the Confederatioin as protectorate colonies.
Pilgrim Cross:
The Pilgrim dagger-cross is the most sacred symbol of the sect. The dagger represents divine judgement against unbelievers, and the cross symbolizes the salvation of the elect.
Pilgrim crosses worn as jewelry traditionally keep the sharpened dagger blade feature. Fore safety's sake, the blade can be sheathed, or recessed into the cross with a spring-trigger release. Some of the more ornate crosses are believed to have been chemically treated so that they glow or shimmer in response to the wearer's body chemistry.
History:
The historical roots of the Pilgrim Alliance lie in the solar expansion of the 22nd century and the ecocatastrophe of the 23rd. In 2167 the United Nations established Olympia Station, the first permanent human settlement on another planet. Supported by space stations on Phobos and Luna, the Olympia colony became the primary staging are for humanity's migration to the outer planets of the Sol system. By 2215 the U.N. had established further permanent colonies on the moons of Jupiter and Saturn, placed research facilities on the satellites of Uranus and Neptune, and landed on Pluto. In that same timespan Terra became ever-increasingly reliant on the outer planets for heavy industrial metals.
In 2219 the first of the Great Pandemics appeared. After the loss of Luna Station, the outer planets sealed themselves off entirely from earth. The rules were simple-for the duration of the medical emergency, no one from Terra could travel beyond the Legrange transit stations. Any colonist who chose to return to Terra could not return to space until such time as the quarantine was lifted.
It was possible for the outer planets to seal themselves off, because by this time the colonies were virtualy self-sustaining. Oxygen and water could be obtained from the rings of Saturn and the ice caps of the larger outer moons, while mineral resources were prolific on Mars and the asteroid belt, with the resources of the outer moons held in reserve. More exotic compounds were being siphoned from the outer atmospheres of Jupiter and Saturn.
Terra, struggling against the ever-rising tide of disease and famine, became increasingly reliant on the mineral wealth of the outer planets to sustain the remnants of its faltering production infrastructure. With fossil fuels virtually exhausted and the biosphere turning ever more hostile, Terra became completely dependent on the outer planets for fuel and the raw materials for self-contained hydroponic systems that provided Terra's only safe food supply.
***Mars was the site of Olympia Station, the first Terran settlement on another planet.
Mining colonies on Mar's inner moon, Phobos- supported the planetary bases as humanity expanded outward. Eventually, such colonies would allow the outer planets the self-sufficiency they needed to maintain the quarantine of Terra.***
These imports were dropped impersonally down Terra's gravity well, with no physical contact between Terra and her colonies. At first, Terra could trade data and cultural resources for these raw materials. However, the colonies became more self-sufficient and their indigenous culture continued to evolve, while Terra's data and cultural industries fell prey to the general economic and social chaos. The colonies were faced with an ever-increasing demand from Terra, but ever-diminishing expectations for fair payment. Meanwhile, on Terra, popular resentment was growing against the rich, healthy, and aloof extraterrestials.
The Final Exodus:
The emergent culture of the outer planets was ripe for new and radical philosophies. The most successful of these new worldviews arose from the writings of Ivar Chu McDaniel (2257-2311?), an organic chemist and lay-preacher assigned to the Neptune research base.
While stationed on Neptune, in 2294, McDaniel began to experience ecstatic visions. He believed that in these visions he experienced direct communion with the Divine, receiving prophetic revelations. He wrote of his experiences to friends on Mars, who encouraged him to collect and publish his insights.
McDaniel claimed that he had been chosen to receive his visions because he was a spiritually receptive individual located at the very fringe of human settlement of Sol system. McDaniel taught that the prophesied apocalypse had occured, but divine judgment was confined to Terra itself. Those humans who had migrated to other worlds constituted and "Elect", destined for physical and spiritual salvation and protection. However, because of the pervasive corruption of Terra, the divine presence could not fully empower the Elect as long as they remained in the Sol system. To complete their salvation, the Elect must undertake the "Final Exodus", leaving Sol system entirely to seek spiritual and genetic perfection among the stars. In McDaniel's mystical cosmography, Terra was Hell, the universe at large was Heaven, and the remainder of Sol system constituted a sort of Limbo where the chosen remnant could prepare itself.
McDaniel's views gained momentum in 2304, with the discovery of the Morvan Drive (popularly known as the "hopper" drive), which allowed interstellar distances to be covered in a matter of months or years, rather than generations. By 2309 the Outer Planets Policy Council was firmly in the control of the McDanielites. In 2311 the first Morvan Colony ship was launched. Bound for the Sirius system, it contained 1200 colonists, including Ivar Chu McDaniel. The ship never arrived at its destination-orthodox pilgrim theology teaches that McDaniel and his crew were translated directly to a higher plane of existance, from which McDaniel continues to spiritually direct his followers.
Subsequent sloship efforts were successful, however, to a degree that modern historians find frankly amazing. Missions to Alpha and Proxima Centauri, Cygnus and a second Sirius mission all arrived at their destinations and successfully established self-sustaining settlements. By 2350 regular trade routes were being established between Titan and the Centauri colonies. It was during this time that the McDanielists began to refer to those who took passage on the colony ships as "Pilgrims".
[Edited by Earthworm on 12-26-2000 at 00:29]
