Penny-Arcade and WC Movie

(and I'm fairly certain the CIC would've had her biotelemetry)
Haesslich: I don't want to be too stingy with my :D's... this above quote in combination with your exploding ship theory is probably about as solid a theory as can be made for this pathetic screenwriting mistake. So here it is: :D :D :D :D.. (even though I still think it could have been a biotelemetry error due to malfunctions of the damaged ship). It's believable enough though, that if I was Admiral Tolwyn I wouldn't charge Angel with murder for her decision. I'd just think she made a foolish decision in the heat of combat.
It's too bad they couldn't have made the pilot "Cobra" from WC3. The Kilrathi could have picked her up alive in her ship and have her end up a Kilrathi slave that eventually escapes just like in WC3.. unfortunately this couldn't work though because Cobra was taken as a slave at age 10 and escaped at 20.. Plus Maniac would be guilty of falling for some SERIOUS jail bait in this movie.. "I'm telling you Admiral Tolwyn.. she looked like she was AT LEAST in her 30's!!!!" Of course changing the age of her time as a slave would be par for the course in this movie (along the lines of English Belgians and French Scotsmen with completely different responsibilities/rankings/relationships/etc. etc. as the games). I'm very glad they didn't do it..
 
Quote:
Hi ChrisRead!

Well played.
lol, thanks Bandit.. actually I just wrote fast because I realized he was posting here at the same time and wanted to say Hi before he jumped off- being my first time here I wasn't use to the "Reid" spelling. It was NOT AT ALL to suggest that Chris has a problem "read"ing posts as it may have appeared. He does however seem to have an adverse physical reaction to reading ;). Just playing Chris, and sorry for butchering your last name!
Because your post made me out of breath.
---ChrisReid aka ChrisRead!
 
Mjr. Whoopass said:
Of course changing the age of her time as a slave would be par for the course in this movie (along the lines of English Belgians and French Scotsmen with completely different responsibilities/rankings/relationships/etc. etc. as the games). I'm very glad they didn't do it..

You summed up the half hour my poor brain spent stumbling through a thesarus into one sentence. You magnificent bastard. :D

And I coulda swore I posted a response to LOAF aside from the ones I see... musta "Gone MIA." Oh well.

edit- corrected some spelling. I have got to stop posting at 4 am...
 
To address the Wing Commander Academy bit -- the idea that Blair has adopted parents (who he'd be writing to) was introduced earlier than the Wing Commander movie.

It's actually directly referenced in Academy. Blair has a photo of his father in a military uniform, and when he's hallucinating the 'ghost' of his father appears to him to remind him about his duty as a soldier... but the person he's *writing* to is someone who's against the war ("I know you disagreed with my decision to come here..." letter).

One of the plot lines for the second season would have introduced the character Blair is writing to as an "anti war" senator. The press kit references this somewhat.
 
Angel was from Brussels, wasn't she?

That's correct, per Claw Marks. (The movie novel also references this fact).

And the Blair parent thing is nowhere near as interesting as Maniac's homeworld.

The weird homeworld listing errors in Wing Commander IV were a big deal to us in 1996, but in retrospect they aren't much of an error. We know that he's from Proxima Centauri from various anectdotes from his youth there... he may just live on Mars in 2673.

(Where's my home? Texas, where I actually live? Maryland, where all my crap is and I spent 90% of my life? Washington DC, where I tell everyone I'm from because no one knows where Maryland is? Etc.)
 
The accent-choices were pretty rotten... Our old friend Taggart becoming Jacques Cousteau being a prime example (I think that's the main reason why it doesn't sit right with me. "Zee space, she is vast 'end wild.."), another being Angel. There is no way to explain this away, except that the casting guys didn't play Wing Commander, or even pay attention to Mr. Roberts.
"She's perfect, stick her in!"
"Uhh, the script calls for a Belgian woman."
"Dude, she's hot! Besides, who the hell knows what Belgians sound like?"
"Oh, all right..."
Also, the whole "refit British planes to look spacey" thing. Not cool. Jets TODAY don't look like that, why the heck would they revert to such a non-aerodynamic design in the future? (The futuristic Simpsons episode comes to mind... "Jumbo Byplanes," anyone?) Yes, I know, extremely little drag in space, but these things might have to enter atmosphere from time to time. I mean seriously, was it that much more expensive to just CGI the damn things?
(and another post vanishes... I think someone's trying to mess with my head. whootee-frickin-doo.)
 
Manic said:
Also, the whole "refit British planes to look spacey" thing. Not cool. Jets TODAY don't look like that, why the heck would they revert to such a non-aerodynamic design in the future? Yes, I know, extremely little drag in space, but these things might have to enter atmosphere from time to time. I mean seriously, was it that much more expensive to just CGI the damn things?
They did CGI the damn things - but when you want Blair sitting in the cockpit on occasion, you want to be able to shoot him sitting in the cockpit :p.
And as for the non-aerodynamicness of it - like you said, no drag in space. But what if they enter atmosphere? Well, gee, I guess the point is that they don't :p. Remember how Halcyon screams his head off in WC1 after Hunter entered Firekka atmosphere in a Rapier II? The question you should be asking is not why the Rapier I is so unaerodynamic, but why the Rapier II, a ship not intended to be flown in atmosphere, is so aerodynamic. All those wings and winglets... sure they look cool, but don't they just make the damn thing harder to store on a carrier?
 
The accent-choices were pretty rotten... Our old friend Taggart becoming Jacques Cousteau being a prime example (I think that's the main reason why it doesn't sit right with me. "Zee space, she is vast 'end wild.."), another being Angel. There is no way to explain this away, except that the casting guys didn't play Wing Commander, or even pay attention to Mr. Roberts.
"She's perfect, stick her in!"
"Uhh, the script calls for a Belgian woman."
"Dude, she's hot! Besides, who the hell knows what Belgians sound like?"
"Oh, all right..."

I'm pretty sure we already talked about the accents in this very thread.

... Yes, we did. And not the royal we, you and I specifically. You posted this already and I already responded. And then you didnt' reply.

Also, the whole "refit British planes to look spacey" thing. Not cool. Jets TODAY don't look like that, why the heck would they revert to such a non-aerodynamic design in the future? (The futuristic Simpsons episode comes to mind... "Jumbo Byplanes," anyone?) Yes, I know, extremely little drag in space, but these things might have to enter atmosphere from time to time. I mean seriously, was it that much more expensive to just CGI the damn things?

So, to boil this down... you don't like that they're real airplanes... because you're worried that that means they won't be able to act like real airplanes? That's kind of a reach.

I'mnot sure what people have been telling you about history, but even ugly British jets were usually designed to fly in the atmosphere.

(and another post vanishes... I think someone's trying to mess with my head. whootee-frickin-doo.)

I have absolutely no idea what this means.
 
I'm pretty sure we already talked about the accents in this very thread.

... Yes, we did. And not the royal we, you and I specifically. You posted this already and I already responded. And then you didnt' reply.
I thought I had responded. I really have to stop ENDING my day by visiting the forum... or during periods of insomnia... my brain's a bit scrambled after only an hour's sleep. :(

Anyway, back on track. The actors used were good actors, just poorly chosen accent-wise(they could have at least trained someone to use the correct accent... it's done all the time in hollywood.). Nothing's going to change my stance on that one. Paladin with a french accent would be like a Mexican Hunter. (note: I have no bias against any race, creed, or culture. I'm just citing an example.) On a side note, I'm glad they did Hunter right... that crazy bastard was always a kick to fly with.

The design gripe was just a small part of it, listing an example. I'll go at length, I suppose... but I'm entering into fanboy-isms here, an area I don't like much... then again, I've been there since '95... ;)

1.Sure, it can fly in the atmosphere... but can it ENTER it? At Wing Commander speeds, during combat? A craft like that wouldn't survive re-entry, I'd think. The wings would likely shear off... then again, most WC designs don't look like they'd survive re-entry. In fact, this is one thing I feel the WC games did very well...

2. Personal taste. This thing looks nothing like any design around it's own age, including the Scimitar. Also a moot point, I suppose, because they turned the Tiger's Claw into the Red October anyway... Now, I could see design schemes changing rather quickly, over the last 20 years airplanes/jets have evolved a great deal... but the design is simply inefficient and rediculous. (then again, we are talking about a sci-fi movie based around a sci-fi video game which started out in the days of 640x480 resolution, and revised to appeal to the masses and not cost a billion dollars to produce)
Quarto, you brought up some excellent points in WC canon, and some sensible points about the cockpit shots. (I would think it wouldn't be that expensive to have a bogus cockpit fabricated, in fact I'd think it would be cheaper than buying an entire airframe, but no use screaming about it) I suppose there are a great number of space-only fighters that exist in the fiction...
One thing that does confuse me, is the Gattling Mass Driver, when only six months later, they reveal static mass drivers with (at least) similar fire rates. I suppose they just needed something to cover what used to be the nose cone, but it's another slap in the original fiction's face... It was interesting to see, but the Rapier I design (not sure of it's conception date) had to be about as old as our favorite sluggish beast of a fighter... Why the lack of mass-driver gattlings in WC1? or the existance of other fighter-based energy weapons, which we don't see at all? (Neutron Guns come to mind, as well as the tried-and-true Laser)

One thing though... just for the record. I am not siding with anyone on liking, or disliking the Wing Commander Movie. I came to that conclusion on my own. (LOAF, I'm sure you recall that we've butted heads over this many times in the past, though the most we could manage was to agree to disagree)

Ah, well. moot point. Well, have fun lads, I'll be gone for the next week and a half on a visit to Texas. I'll be sure to try and visit the old Origin HQ, if it still exists... to pay my respects. ;)
 
1.Sure, it can fly in the atmosphere... but can it ENTER it? At Wing Commander speeds, during combat? A craft like that wouldn't survive re-entry, I'd think. The wings would likely shear off... then again, most WC designs don't look like they'd survive re-entry. In fact, this is one thing I feel the WC games did very well...

Sure -- every 'atmospheric entry' scene we've ever seen has made pretty clear that the *shields* (rather than the hull) is what functions as the heat shield. (Aerodynamics isn't exactly a requirement for surviving re-entry, anyway. Try dogfighting in a CSM.)

2. Personal taste. This thing looks nothing like any design around it's own age, including the Scimitar. Also a moot point, I suppose, because they turned the Tiger's Claw into the Red October anyway... Now, I could see design schemes changing rather quickly, over the last 20 years airplanes/jets have evolved a great deal... but the design is simply inefficient and rediculous. (then again, we are talking about a sci-fi movie based around a sci-fi video game which started out in the days of 640x480 resolution, and revised to appeal to the masses and not cost a billion dollars to produce)

Eh, it follows a similar design pattern to a lot of Wing Commander ships... the Morningstar is an F-15 in space, the Thunderbolt is an A-6 in space, the Broadsword is a B-17 in space, etc. Taking "real" airplanes and turning them into spaceships is a Wing Commander chesnut.

(And your resolution is too high -- the original games were 320x240.)

Quarto, you brought up some excellent points in WC canon, and some sensible points about the cockpit shots. (I would think it wouldn't be that expensive to have a bogus cockpit fabricated, in fact I'd think it would be cheaper than buying an entire airframe, but no use screaming about it) I suppose there are a great number of space-only fighters that exist in the fiction...

Eh, look how cheap the Hellcat cockpit sets from the beginning of Wing Commander IV looked... ugly or not, the switches and VDUs and whatnot inside the Rapiers looked really realistic.

One thing that does confuse me, is the Gattling Mass Driver, when only six months later, they reveal static mass drivers with (at least) similar fire rates. I suppose they just needed something to cover what used to be the nose cone, but it's another slap in the original fiction's face... It was interesting to see, but the Rapier I design (not sure of it's conception date) had to be about as old as our favorite sluggish beast of a fighter... Why the lack of mass-driver gattlings in WC1? or the existance of other fighter-based energy weapons, which we don't see at all? (Neutron Guns come to mind, as well as the tried-and-true Laser)

It's actually a gatling neutron gun, according to the handbook. (And "Gatling Mass Driver Cannon" is the proper name for the regular mass driver, according to Claw Marks.)

That said, it certainly has a WC-historical analogue -- the "stormfire cannon" introduced in Wing Commander IV. Their backstory was that they were older technology that the Border Worlds had dug out for the current conflict... so the appearance of similar weapons earlier in the timeline (in the movie) makes sense. A lot more sense than shoehorning them into Prophecy did, anyway...

(LOAF, I'm sure you recall that we've butted heads over this many times in the past, though the most we could manage was to agree to disagree)

I really don't keep track of who I argue with about the movie. Aside from rare exceptions, chat zone debates aren't personal.

Ah, well. moot point. Well, have fun lads, I'll be gone for the next week and a half on a visit to Texas. I'll be sure to try and visit the old Origin HQ, if it still exists... to pay my respects.

The building is still there. The Origin sign is either covered up or gone (the was a 'FOR LEASE' banner the last time I was out there).

Have fun -- I'm already home for the holidays, otherwise I'd offer to buy you a drink.
 
(And your resolution is too high -- the original games were 320x240.)
Lower yet in fact. 320x200. All the screenshots one sees look a bit flattened since they generally don't correct the aspect ratio.
 
Whoops. I'm in the middle of packing, but figured I'd take one last glance at the CZ before powering down my rig for the week...
That said, it certainly has a WC-historical analogue -- the "stormfire cannon" introduced in Wing Commander IV. Their backstory was that they were older technology that the Border Worlds had dug out for the current conflict... so the appearance of similar weapons earlier in the timeline (in the movie) makes sense. A lot more sense than shoehorning them into Prophecy did, anyway...
True, but those were actual physical rounds being fired, and the weapon was much smaller... the Gatling Neutron gun (My mistake, it has been a while since I looked at the fiction) still seems like a backslide to me... the concept could have been applied to turrets on WC2, those mothers would have churned out some real damage.
I really don't keep track of who I argue with about the movie. Aside from rare exceptions, chat zone debates aren't personal.
True, pretty much everyone has debated on one side or the other(and some, both) through the years...
The building is still there. The Origin sign is either covered up or gone (the was a 'FOR LEASE' banner the last time I was out there).

Have fun -- I'm already home for the holidays, otherwise I'd offer to buy you a drink.
Perhaps next run down there I'll catch you. ;) This week's pretty much just me-and-my-girl time, but next run... would be fun. ;)
The building is still there. The Origin sign is either covered up or gone (the was a 'FOR LEASE' banner the last time I was out there).

Have fun -- I'm already home for the holidays, otherwise I'd offer to buy you a drink.
I wonder what they did with the old sign... if it's small enough, it'd make one hell of a collectors item... woah, just had an interesting idea. I'm going to find out if I can commission an Origin "neon beer sign" for my den. :D
Anyways, I'm off to Abeline!
 
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