Midway Carrier Program - Pros/Cons

Do you support the MIDWAY program?

  • YES

    Votes: 18 66.7%

  • NO

    Votes: 9 33.3%
  • Total voters
    27
Originally posted by Jonas Davenger
By the way, a question. Isn't the Vesuvious faster than the Midway? Yet the Midway is considerably lighter? Is it because of the engines? Or is it just the game system...
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Well in SO the Vesuvius is quite a bit faster then the Midway in Prophecy, 200 kps for the Vesu, 80 kps for the Mid, HOWEVER, in the SO game engine the Vesuvius loses the super-maneuverabilty it had in WC4, also in SO the Vesu loses all its cap ship guns, and is just armed with plain ol turret lasers, so take the Vesuvius class performance in SO with a huge grain of salt...
 
That's a lot to wade through... so let me point out a few things.

* Just like the Midway, the Vesuvius would have had a battle group were it actually going to war. Just look at the 'losing' cut scenes... the Vesuvius is the centerpiece of a huge fleet.

* A bunch of people pointed out what Border Worlds forces were thrown against the Vesuvius. I don't think anyone remembered the fighter complement off the BWS Princeton or the group of corvettes Wilford sent away early-on during the fighting.

* In-game specs are a difficult thing to debate over -- especially the Vesuvius' armaments in Secret Ops, given that the ship doesn't appear in any sort of non-scripted manner (in fact, troubles getting the turrets to work properly are exactly why you don't have a mission with her...).



* Lastly, of course, Blair is a *brilliant* ship designer... he thought to leave a big blank space for the space-crystal ;) (Seriously, though, Blair didn't design the Midway himself...)
 
Originally posted by Bandit LOAF
* Just like the Midway, the Vesuvius would have had a battle group were it actually going to war. Just look at the 'losing' cut scenes... the Vesuvius is the centerpiece of a huge fleet.
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So where was the MIDWAY's battle group throughout the bulk of WCP? Through the whole game the thing was doing END RUNS into Kilrathi territory and trying to run away from the new Alien threat.
 
Originally posted by pygmypiranha
So where was the MIDWAY's battle group throughout the bulk of WCP? Through the whole game the thing was doing END RUNS into Kilrathi territory and trying to run away from the new Alien threat.
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Erm, the Midway was *trapped* in Kilrathi space during a shakedown cruise, remember? She was cut off from Confed... I'm sure that Midway is now (circa Secret Ops) the center of a battlegroup.
 
Originally posted by pygmypiranha
So where was the MIDWAY's battle group throughout the bulk of WCP? Through the whole game the thing was doing END RUNS into Kilrathi territory and trying to run away from the new Alien threat.
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Midway's battle group wasn't ready yet - remember, this was a shakedown cruise. It wasn't meant to go into battle - which is why it was missing the Vampires and Devastators of the Wolfpack squadron... those had to be sent to us, once it was clear we needed them, and were going on the offensive.

Otherwise, Blair wouldn't have been onboard to get captured. :D

The fact of the matter is this - Midway is a big target, but she's also just one target, with a limited number of vulnerable points. WCP capship combat requires you take out several key points to disable the ship's control and manuvering capabilities; shields at this point are good enough to make the old-fashioned 'full ship kill' of previous Wing Commander games improbable. Remember, we didn't need to target any specific sections before WCP - we just had to deliver enough torpedoes to kill the enemy ship.

Now, in Prophecy, we have to kill specific subsystems and targets - Engines and Bridge. It still takes a few moments to get around to these targets with maneuvering speed in a single fighter, and she's got enough turrets and fighters to make hitting these targets a problem - you can't just launch a torpedo from any old angle and blow the ship open anymore. You have to hit those two specific targets from very close range, lest the torpedo get hit by defensive turret fire.

With this sort of requirement for anticapship operations, the 'big target' is suddenly a better choice for a fleet than five or six targets... five or six more vulnerable targets. It's a lot easier to have BARCAP around the main targets of engine and bridge, even if it means you may lose the capabilities of the science ship and marine transport the Midway represents should you screw up.

In peacetime, the Midway is the best platform you could buy. In wartime, it's a valuable asset because it can do research on the fly without waiting for a science division base or ship somewhere to figure out what targets to aim for. They're onboard, they're integrated, and they can even use the onboard facilities to modify your weapons to be more effective.
 
Originally posted by Haesslich
shields at this point are good enough to make the old-fashioned 'full ship kill' of previous Wing Commander games improbable. Remember, we didn't need to target any specific sections before WCP - we just had to deliver enough torpedoes to kill the enemy ship.

Now, in Prophecy, we have to kill specific subsystems and targets - Engines and Bridge. It still takes a few moments to get around to these targets with maneuvering speed in a single fighter, and she's got enough turrets and fighters to make hitting these targets a problem - you can't just launch a torpedo from any old angle and blow the ship open anymore
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Bear in mind that it's still quite possible to destroy a ship like the Midway without targeting components.. as we see when a Kraken or Tiamat gets lined up, or as we'll see in Prophecy Advance next month. It just happens that targeting components gets the job done better.. just like it does in past games (targeting engines/flight deck in WC3/4, etc).
 
Originally posted by ChrisReid
Bear in mind that it's still quite possible to destroy a ship like the Midway without targeting components.. as we see when a Kraken or Tiamat gets lined up, or as we'll see in Prophecy Advance next month. It just happens that targeting components gets the job done better.. just like it does in past games (targeting engines/flight deck in WC3/4, etc).
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But isn't that because they've both got the huge plasma cannon which we ended up jacking to mount on Midway? Though it is true, that thing puts out more power than is needed to overload the shields... I wonder if there are any fighter-mounted weapons which could do a full-ship kill, right now. The plasma cannon off our Devastators had the power of a Valiant LT, or so it seemed.
 
Originally posted by Haesslich
But isn't that because they've both got the huge plasma cannon which we ended up jacking to mount on Midway? Though it is true, that thing puts out more power than is needed to overload the shields... I wonder if there are any fighter-mounted weapons which could do a full-ship kill, right now. The plasma cannon off our Devastators had the power of a Valiant LT, or so it seemed.
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As I just said, regular fighters during a full-ship kill will be shown in Prophecy Advance.
 
In WCP Advance, will they be keeping the restriction where only torps and the Devestator's plasma cannon can destory capships, or will regular guns and missiles be able to as well?
 
We're probably looking at a couple regular GBA's and up to a few copies of Prophecy. No SP's unfortunately, but they really are great. The party will be in #Wingnut on irc.
https://www.wcnews.com/wingnut
 
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Originally posted by StarLight
I'd only want to play WCP on Gameboy Advance or GameCube just for the multiplayer...*sigh*
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I'm thinking about getting the game if and when it comes out here.
 
I don't order anything online. Call me old-fashioned, but I prefer to see a product in my hand before paying for it. Returns are always a hassle, and I don't have a credit card anyway.
 
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