FAB Ranks

Originally posted by Starkey
When I talked about the "carrier based Mirages" and "Mirages we sold to Africa" read HARRIERS. My mistake, sorry.
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Harriers? When did we ever have harriers?

About other countries in Latin America, Quarto, we do have a good army and the best navy in the region, but our Airforce sucks bad, I think Peru could wipe our planes out quickly with their F-16s.
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Don't Venezuela have F-16s? I think Peru have Mirage 2000s and MiG 29s. Well, it's still good.

And why would we be worried about that? Well, Brazil has been an important moderator in the Latin America conflicts, and having a relatively large military power helps a lot on that. And I´m sure our squadrons of F-5s, *Mirages IIIEBR* and A-4s :( don´t help much. The only noticeable fighter we have is the AMX, but it is used for bombing runs only, for being too slow.
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The AMX is a subsonic bomber that can defend itself. But as fighter it's very limited. We have the mighty Xavantes and Tucanos!
 
Originally posted by Quarto
But Brazil already has a far more powerful military than its neighbours. There is no country in your region that could threaten Brazil in any way, and the only global players that could reach Brazil are those that could kick its ass regardless of how much it spends on the military. A military to match your importance? If Brazil wants to spend money on something to show its importance, please, invest in the space programme.
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1. The only country that can kick our ass in that scenario is the USA. I say that with pride, because the USA can kick anybody's ass.

2. Buying Su-35 is the best investment because the Russians said they would help us with our space program.

Reading the information from the links you posted, I tend to agree - the Su-37 (35?) seems to be the best choice, though. I don't think Brazil actually needs it, but if a choice had be made, then the Su-37 would be the way to go. I was also mildly amused by the reasons for the downfall of the Brazilian arms industry... :p
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Read about the Osorio Tank. It's kinda of a sad story.

I'll quote this small part of the site, copyright GlobalSecurity.org.

EE-T2 Osório
By the mid-1980s, Engesa had spent US$100 million on the development of the Osório, a main battle tank, but was unable to find a buyer for it. This design of the Brazilian armaments industry was sophisticated, and demanded a high investment in technology. It was equipped with computers and endowed with a modern system of weapons. The improved version would have receive the designation of EE-T1 (armed with a 120mm cannon), and the version that would have been adopted for the Brazilian Army (armed with a 105mm cannon) the EE-T2 Osório [but this was never really defined].

The original model was provided for real tests in Saudi Arabia, it was the winner of the competition between M-1 Abrams, 40 AMX and Challenger, in the late 1980s. The Osório project came to an abrupt end with Operation Desert Storm against Iraq in 1991. In 1990 Engesa had won the evaluation process by the Saudis. After Desert Storm, Brazil was no match for United States competition, given the close ties that developed between Saudi Arabia and the United States during the war with Iraq.
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Originally posted by Delance
Harriers? When did we ever have harriers?
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:eek: When did I dream of that? .. ...
Anyway, you´re right, it weren´t the Harriers that we had on our carrier and sold to Africa, they were S-2 Trackers:

p-16.jpg


Originally posted by Delance
Don't Venezuela have F-16s? I think Peru have Mirage 2000s and MiG 29s. Well, it's still good.
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yeah, whatever... the point is that Hugo Chavez can kick our ass too.
 
Originally posted by Starkey
yeah, whatever... the point is that Hugo Chavez can kick our ass too.
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Considering the effort our president is making in preventing the popular movement from ovethrowing el revolucionario Chavez, I don't think there's much of a chance that would happen. Besides, all they have are 26 or so F-16s, it wouldn't make much of a difference.
 
Airforce vs. Airforce, it would make a difference, since we have like 40 AMX, 25 F-5s and 6 Mirage, and the F-16s would feast on them.
 
The F-16's can't do much without good missiles. We have plenty. Do they?

It's irrelevant, anyway. Lula's support is keeping Chaves in power. If they become enemies, Chaves won't have much need to the airforce save to escape to Cuba if his revolutionary regime is overthrown.
 
I know... there will be no war here for a long time ahead. I am just stating stuff about the military balance in the region.
 
Originally posted by Starkey
The Rafale is a great fighter. The Mirage 2000 ain´t.
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Did you fly it ?

Now, the Su-35/37 has appeared in some comparisons to the Eurofighter and the F-22. It loses to them, but not by much. Do I need to say more?
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The Eurofighter is not that great... Though, I must admit the Su-35 looks pretty nice... but is it really reliable ?

Anyway, France is willing to sell us a *special*version of the Mirage 2000, called the "Mirage 2000-5BR", which obviously would be stripped of the latest technology advances. Russia, on the other hand, agreed to sell us the same Su-35 that they use.
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Ask South Korea why we do not wanna sell aircrafts that we use :mad:
 
F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!
 
Originally posted by dacis2
F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!F-22!
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Stop spamming. The F-22's also one of the most expensive fighters in the world, which is why you're buying the F-35 JSF in large numbers for your Air Force, Navy, and Marines.
 
Well, Brazil can't buy F-22s. F/A-18 are too expensive. They won't sell F-15s. From the fighters available, the Su-35 is the best.
 
Originally posted by Delance
Well, Brazil can't buy F-22s. F/A-18 are too expensive. They won't sell F-15s. From the fighters available, the Su-35 is the best.
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The F/A-22s are 99 million USD apiece, and they're not being sold to anyone outside the US, I think. The F-35's are more affordable, though. Yeah, you might be better off sticking with the Russians, unless the Rafaele or Eurofighter Typhoon actually pan out to be a better value. Not sure what your current state of relations with France is, though.
 
Originally posted by Haesslich
Not sure what your current state of relations with France is, though.
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Our president likes to kiss french ass. Not as much as cuban ass, but it's close enought. Since the presidential campagin he plans to spend the 700 million USD of the F-X project on french outdated Mirage 2000's. And yes, we got yet another outdated carrier from Europe.

The previous one was called NaeL Minas Gerais, former HMS Vengeance. The current one was a french carrier renamed NaeL São Paulo.
 
Originally posted by NoRemorse
You don't have a great opinion about french people, do you ? ;)
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If they had a reputation of ripping you off and acting snobby, yeah, I wouldn't have a high reputation of them either. :D
 
Originally posted by NoRemorse
You don't have a great opinion about french people, do you ? ;)
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I like the french! This issues of airplanes have nothing to do with the french people!
 
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