Capital Ships - Weapon Placement

Made some substantial progress the last couple of days; the Privateer ships are done and I was also able to knock out the two Arena battlecruisers (I may have had to fudge a little on where half-a-dozen laser emplacements were located; there aren't very many pics of those Arena ships from more than one perspective). The WC3 ships are next up and I was able to go through them this morning and pick out the emplacements on the vast majority of those without any trouble (I missed one or two on the Kilrathi ships, with only the Hvar'kann giving me any serious trouble - I may get to revisit that ship later on).

So, I'm going to forge ahead here and move on to the WC4 ships - of which there are four in the catalog. The Concordia-class was the very first capship I did (to check costs) and two of them are the Ella Superbase and the Pasqual Starbase. I don't even know if those two are armed or not - there are no stats for them in either the Ships Database or WCPedia, which, come to think of it, means I'll probably drop them from the catalog entirely. It wouldn't be the first time I chucked out a starbase; there were the two P2 pirate bases for which I didn't have data. Sure would hate to do it, though.

Which I guess just leaves the Vesuvius-class for WC4. The paint jobs were different between WC3 and WC4 and the designers in WC4 weren't nice enough to put little yellow squares outlining the turrets, so I can't pick the damn things out. And apparently there's supposed to be a lot of them.

What about the SO version of the ship? Does anybody have any top down and side pictures of it?
 
WC4 weren't nice enough to put little yellow squares outlining the turrets, so I can't pick the damn things out. And apparently there's supposed to be a lot of them.
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Check the big screen behind Holo-Eisen. Also, you can individually target them ingame, just cycle components and count them in WC4(or SO)
 
Gonna be working on these in the very near future (as in probably tomorrow), and my sources are ambiguous on the matter, so I figured I'd go for broke:

Kilrathi Supply Depot in WC3: armed or not?
Ella Superbase in WC4: armed or not?
Pasqual Starbase in WC4: armed or not?

Any help here would be really nice. I'm liable to make all three unarmed unless I hear otherwise.
 
Alrighty then. That's actually very helpful.

I got to ask about the fighter complement for Blackmane Station. I actually prepped the stats for that one a couple of days ago and from what I could tell it only had a light fighter compliment. That seems incongruous to me considering how big the station is. I did go ahead and built it with a light fighter compliment nonetheless (went with eight of each of the four main WC3 Confed fighter/bombers - no Excaliburs but left room to add them). I'm just wondering if I should've added more.
 
I got to ask about the fighter complement for Blackmane Station. I actually prepped the stats for that one a couple of days ago and from what I could tell it only had a light fighter compliment. That seems incongruous to me considering how big the station is. I did go ahead and built it with a light fighter compliment nonetheless (went with eight of each of the four main WC3 Confed fighter/bombers - no Excaliburs but left room to add them). I'm just wondering if I should've added more.
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I don't believe there are any published stats for Blackmane's fighter capacity; it was a major fleet base, though, and not some odd outpost, so it would make sense that it would have quite a few fighters (in fact, Victory picks up spares at Blackmane in the novelization.)

No need to leave room for Excaliburs; canonically, Blackmane was dismantled before they came online.

Let me go back and see what I missed in this thread (that strange storm knocked me offline for a week, I'm only catching up now...)

Made some substantial progress the last couple of days; the Privateer ships are done and I was also able to knock out the two Arena battlecruisers (I may have had to fudge a little on where half-a-dozen laser emplacements were located; there aren't very many pics of those Arena ships from more than one perspective). The WC3 ships are next up and I was able to go through them this morning and pick out the emplacements on the vast majority of those without any trouble (I missed one or two on the Kilrathi ships, with only the Hvar'kann giving me any serious trouble - I may get to revisit that ship later on).
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The missing laser turrets are probably the ones on 'top' of the ship (that you can get to at the very end of the battle.)
 
Bandit LOAF said:
I don't believe there are any published stats for Blackmane's fighter capacity; it was a major fleet base, though, and not some odd outpost, so it would make sense that it would have quite a few fighters (in fact, Victory picks up spares at Blackmane in the novelization.)
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Hmm....then it might behoove me to go ahead and up the number. That's a relief, actually...the price of Blackmane came in at just over a third of the cost of a Yorktown-class carrier using WCRPG's system (as first created).

Bandit LOAF said:
No need to leave room for Excaliburs; canonically, Blackmane was dismantled before they came online.
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Presumably, though, there are other bases of the same type as Blackmane within the Confederation...a few of them might've still been online when the Excalibur was finally introduced. Nevertheless, I will not be adding them to that type of station for WCRPG.

Bandit LOAF said:
The missing laser turrets are probably the ones on 'top' of the ship (that you can get to at the very end of the battle.)
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I was able to go back and pick them out eventually; I finished the last of the WC3 ships yesterday.

Vesuvius is going to be the tallest order of my day today - 54 gun stations...

Bandit LOAF said:
Let me go back and see what I missed in this thread (that strange storm knocked me offline for a week, I'm only catching up now...)
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I heard about that derecho y'all had along the east coast; did you have any major damage?
 
Finished readying stats for the WC3/WC4 ships yesterday; I still need to post them. Leaves me with just the Prophecy and Privateer 2 capships at this point.

I could use a good multi-perspective set of images for the Plunkett-class; that's the only Confed one really giving me hell so far. I do have WCPEdit, but I don't have Treman, so the program's image viewer doesn't work and the links to download Treman all appear to have rotted out. I can tell it how many guns it's supposed to have, just not where they're located on the ship's hull.

Might need to do some work with the Hades-class too; need to take a closer look at it. Then there are the Nephilim ships...

I don't really think the P2 ships are going to give me that much trouble, so I may go ahead and skip over the Prophecy ones for now to knock those on out.
 
I could use a good multi-perspective set of images for the Plunkett-class; that's the only Confed one really giving me hell so far. I do have WCPEdit, but I don't have Treman, so the program's image viewer doesn't work and the links to download Treman all appear to have rotted out. I can tell it how many guns it's supposed to have, just not where they're located on the ship's hull.
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I believe this is Treman: hcl.solsector.net/archive/treman1.zip

... but wouldn't it be easier just to fly around these ships and locate the turrets in the game? With Prophecy you can even just highlight them from a distance and swap through the different locations.
 
It might be easier; the problem with that idea is that I'd have to...well, play the game again pretty much the whole way through again. You don't encounter those Tiamats until rather late in Prophecy, IIRC. There might be some trick to a) avoid getting shot down by the defensive fighters long enough to get an accurate turret count and b) making sure the target stays intact long enough to get a count, especially in those later missions. Might work for the Hades, though. I don't recall how far in the first mission with a Plunkett is in SO.

Thanks for the Treman link; I'll give it a shot first before I elect to get shot at.
 
Haha just go to the options and turn invincible on (and/or use the finger of death cheat to eliminate anything you don't want bothering you.) And use any number of save game editors to jump ahead to whichever mission has the ship you want.
 
Well, crap. Treman doesn't work with Windows 7. Figures. Guess I can try things out with my laptop tomorrow; it's still running XP.
 
I never understood editing much, so I can't remember if this is right or not but... try running Treman under DOSBox?
 
I might try that on my Win7 box just for the hell of it. I did get it working on my XP laptop today, so I have a fallback position now at least.

Textures aren't working, but I'm not about to go to a xoom website to get the file I need; wireframes will do just fine.

Now the trick will be to see how the ships are named; I don't see "Plunkett" on the list. For that matter, I don't see "Adelaide", "Bannockburn", or "Tereshkova" either.......hmm. It's under "WC3 Cruiser" for some reason.
 
capi3101 said:
Now the trick will be to see how the ships are named; I don't see "Plunkett" on the list. For that matter, I don't see "Adelaide", "Bannockburn", or "Tereshkova" either.......hmm. It's under "WC3 Cruiser" for some reason.
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Yep. And the Murphy is WC3 destroyer, and the Vesuvius is WC3 carrier (which is almost right :) ). You can tell that the additional capships in SO were all originally planned to be quick recycles from previous games - I guess the art team rebelled and insisted on coming up with something new (actually, the Murphy may have already been done - I think Sean Murphy mentioned somewhere that this was one of the models that got him his job at Origin). Given how terrible the Vesuvius turned out, I'm not surprised they preferred to invent new ships - importing designs from WC3 would have involved just as much work as making a new ship.
 
capi3101 said:
Man, it really did turn out terrible. For starters, they don't have anywhere near fifty guns on the model...
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Yeah, they got terribly lazy with that one. It's not divided properly into components, there are missing faces and collision tree issues, and it's pretty poor on hardpoints. I imagine it might have been a last-minute idea - they already had the Murphies and Plunketts, and someone decided that they really could use a carrier to show on a cutscene. Maybe someone pointed out to them that fans keep asking about the Vesuvius carriers, who knows. Either way, they didn't put much effort getting the model into the game - which is weird, because it still would have taken a fair amount of effort to produce an updated model in the first place.
 
Finished going through the Prophecy capships models. That WCPEdit was useful for the Confederation capital ships, but not so much for the Nephilim ships...in fact, it was fairly worthless for the Nephilim ships; it had all their weapons gathered up in the center of the model. I suppose that could be right. Could just as easily be a limitation of the program.

Anybody know of any good Prophecy mission editors?
 
I know: I'll start a Kickstarter. anybody who gives me five cents will assure that I will complete WCRPG. Anybody who gives me ten cents will let me put the turrets on the f**king Nephilim ships wherever I damn well please. For a quarter, I'll throw in a Star Control RPG; why the f*** not. Anybody who buys me a can of Dr. Pepper will be my friend for life, or at least until the next commercial break. Anybody who wipes my ass for me is a sick bastard who needs to get their hands off my ass.

Kickstarter: the f**king answer for f**king everything.




Sorry. Off-topic, I know. Just had somebody suggest Kickstarter to finish up Starflight III, when funding isn't an issue at all. Kickstarter kinda pisses me off. It's like talking about cat-sniffing or Paradigm-class what-the-f**ks.
 
Back on topic: Midway finished and posted. She turned out to be the last of the canonical Confed ships I needed to add to the game; just got the Nephilim and the P2 ships left.
 
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