Proton Torpedoes

The dome explodes. The bridge shield falls. How freaking complicated is this? That's like saying that when we see "Mark Hamil's Character" in A New Hope, and we hear his Aunt Beru call out, "Luke! Luuuke!", then "Mark Hamil's Character" is not actually Luke, because he doesn't have a little nametag on to say that he is luke.

If it looks like a duck, and walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck IT'S OBVIOUSLY NOT A CHICKEN.

In film, this is called an "establishing shot" it sets up the actions of the next scene so we can understand what is going on. It's a series of related scenes to some important story element, usually shot without dialouge. That's the purpose of showing the A-Wing strike, to set up the Officers next line on the bridge of the Executor.

I have a question for you. By your "logic" (if anyone wants to call it that) how do you know that the A-Wings even blew up a "tower bubble" on the Executor? If you watch the shot, it's clearly not apparent that is the Executor, yet you accept that shot is off the Exectuor, because the NEXT SHOT shows the BRIDGE of the Executor, with the Executors Commanding Officer on board, and they talk about the Executor losing shields. Oh my. They talk about Shields. Well if talking about the Executor is enough that you know the shot previous is off the Executor, why is talking about the shields not enough that you know the previous shot is of a ...gasp...shield generator?

The dome explodes. The bridge shield falls. Draw the obvious conclusion: The dome is the shield generator.

PS: Is that from my longass post? Thanks for correcting me, I knew it was A-Wings, I think I stated somewhere they used Concussion missiles to do it (if I didn't then I meant it) and everyone knows X-Wings=Proton Torepedos A-Wings=Concussion missiles.

Once again:
IF tower bubble blowing = shield failure, THEN tower bubble = shield generator
 
Jason, you're opperating under some false information I'm afaid.

The Imperator-Class Stardestroyer is one mile or 1.6km long.

The Executor-Class Stardestroyer is 17.6km long, based on its bridge conning tower being the same size as an ISD's

The Warload for the X-Wing is 6 Torpedos

The Warload for the Y-Wing is 10

The speeds of the Y-Wing and X-Wing in ROTJ, per the speed chart for the movie, are both 100MGLT. Additionally the X-Wing is rated as being more manuverable than the TIE Fighter.

With all that out of the way the answer to the original question is that an entire fighter group would be needed to take out an ISD. Thats 36 fighters, 12 X-W, 12 Y-W, 12 A-W.

The A-Wings would take out as many fighters as possible with their missiles and then close with who ever was left; then the X-Wings would be sent in to attack the weapons on the ISD and support the A-Wings; finally the Y-Wings would be sent in to attack and destroy the ISD.

Thats not to say that Rogue Squadron couldn't take out an ISD on their own, but thats different.

As to the Issue of what the domes are:

In the film can clearly see tha the ship the Executor from the colour of the hull plating. The fact that the dome is destroyed and then the shileds go down is not prrof of everything. The destruction of the dome could have overloaded the shields or, just as likely the shield went down allowing the dome to be destroyed. There is no way of establishing cause and effect. The answer to the question again comes from the original in house literature for the films, which states "Sensor domes."

As to the issue of canon, the principle is simple: The older something is the higher up the pecking order it is. The movies override everyhting, oldest first. The books/radio plays/notes from the movies override everything except the movies.

So for instance: Much of the literature in the EU states that the X-Wing was a top secret project for the Empire but the Star Wars Radio Play states that it is "two decades" old in A New Hope. Since the radio play is derived from the movie it overrides every later source.
 
That is one possibility lets see how many times had the ship been hit before?
it could be a case of shield failing allows the tower buble to explode.
What is clear though is sensor shielding would need to offer protection while not stoping them form operating and having a tower buble act soly as a shield generator dose not look like a good design idea. The X-wing has shields and they don't seem to have any external generators. so this could mean one of the following either sensors have uniqe shields and this shield also heps pretect the bridge or if shields never block sensors but star destroyers use the mutiple overlaping school of protection and the sensors have their own shields which also help protect the bridge. Either way raises the next question where would the sesnor shields be? Right now the only idicator we have is they are probably in the domes or near by. I just don't see why the domes would be the generators for the whole ship.
 
BattleDog said:
Jason, you're opperating under some false information I'm afaid.

The Imperator-Class Stardestroyer is one mile or 1.6km long.

The Executor-Class Stardestroyer is 17.6km long, based on its bridge conning tower being the same size as an ISD's
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nobody can say either way. Each class has dozens of different sizes listed by numerous sources, but since it is never said in the movies or movie novelizations than you can't argue it. Just by looks I would say the Executor is NOT 17.6 kilometers though. Look at the shots of it next to the ISD's in ESB, it is not 17 times longer.

BattleDog said:
With all that out of the way the answer to the original question is that an entire fighter group would be needed to take out an ISD. Thats 36 fighters, 12 X-W, 12 Y-W, 12 A-W.

The A-Wings would take out as many fighters as possible with their missiles and then close with who ever was left; then the X-Wings would be sent in to attack the weapons on the ISD and support the A-Wings; finally the Y-Wings would be sent in to attack and destroy the ISD.

Thats not to say that Rogue Squadron couldn't take out an ISD on their own, but thats different.
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That would probably work but that isn't to say it's the ONLY way to destroy a Star Destroyer. When I first responded to this post about a squadron of X-Wings being able to do it I took that from the X-Wing book series. They do it all the time in that series and it isn't only Rogue Squadron doint it. More importantly, I didn't say that that was how they did it and that there is no other way for it to happen. There are probably several ways for a fighter squadron to destroy an ISD, so lets just leave it at yes, they can.
 
In the video games the shield generators for all star destroyers are situated on the bridge tower, from this it is fair to say that the spheres on the bridge are shield generators, however they may not be the ONLY shield generators because

A. The X-wing game makes reference to all Star destroyers having to undergo a lengthy and expensive refit in the wake of the Alliances success in utilising small star fighter groups against ISD's vulberable shield system.
B. The executor is a super star destroyer, meaning that it is at *least* 5 times larger than your average ISD, meaning that it probably has additional shield generators situated on its hull somewhere, and these might have already been destroyed prior to the attack on the spherical shield domes.

Thats my opinion and it is bases soley on my playing and reading the X-wing series of games and novels.
 
Jason_Ryock said:
. PS: Is that from my longass post? Thanks for correcting me, I knew it was A-Wings, I think I stated somewhere they used Concussion missiles to do it (if I didn't then I meant it) and everyone knows X-Wings=Proton Torepedos A-Wings=Concussion missiles.
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You're welcome

btw the Falcon also carries Concussion missiles
 
The "shield tower" thing is so silly not because of the continuity involved but the *reasons* involved. Star Wars fans aggresively campaigned for the switch not because they thought it right but rather only because it was a weak point in arguing whether or not Star Destroyers could fight the Enterprise.

There are a million earlier sources that say they're shield towers; there are a few minor later guides and whatnot that claim they aren't, written by people who have some shared interest in the most awful of internet communities. Star Wars continuity works nothing like anyone assumes, so it's hard to say what's right -- but since the reasoning for the switch is so absolutely petty, I think it's best to go with the idea of shield towers. From a purely fun standpoint, it's the better story... the idea that these massive symbols of the Empire have a weak spot with which they can be brought down by dedicated rebels. *That*, rather than retconning explanations to avoid the unlikely story of Captain Picard daring to take advantage of such a weakness and thus insulting everyones very petty manhood, is classic Star Wars.
 
Bandit LOAF said:
The "shield tower" thing is so silly not because of the continuity involved but the *reasons* involved. Star Wars fans aggresively campaigned for the switch not because they thought it right but rather only because it was a weak point in arguing whether or not Star Destroyers could fight the Enterprise.
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Ah, yes. I remember the argument well. The year was 2001, and I was attending college... learning... something- not important to the story. This guy in one of my classes was a dedicated SW fan, and at the time, I was a solid 100% Trekker. We argued long and hard and finaly came to the conclusion that we wheren't going to agree on wich ship would prevail. The next day this guy comes back with an image of Deep Space Nine getting blown up by two SD!!!
Well I couldn't let this stand! I got on my PC and by the next morning, I had this:
 

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Bandit LOAF said:
The "shield tower" thing is so silly not because of the continuity involved but the *reasons* involved. Star Wars fans aggresively campaigned for the switch not because they thought it right but rather only because it was a weak point in arguing whether or not Star Destroyers could fight the Enterprise.
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Doesn't the Star Treck universe have substantially higher speed for its ships then about any other sci-fi universe? So basically noone could catch their ships unless they wanted to.

Not that it matters - lets rather dicuss who would win a space-fight - Christopher Blair or Luke Skywalker ;-)
(no, newbies - this wasn't serious and actually done already...)
 
cff said:
Doesn't the Star Treck universe have substantially higher speed for its ships then about any other sci-fi universe?
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Can they do the Kessel run in less than 12 parsecs?
 
If those are really the shield generators i think that Blissex was pretty stupid or drunk to put that sensible piece of equipment so exposed to attacks.
I should put the generators buried inside the ship, beneath tons. of armor.
 
cff said:
Doesn't the Star Treck universe have substantially higher speed for its ships then about any other sci-fi universe?
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It doesn't work like that. Well it doesn't work at all basically but in fiction;
the warp drives of StarTrek ships create 'waves' in a 'sub-dimention', called subspace. Eatch 'wave' pushes the ship forward, and creating billions of 'waves' per seconds enable the ship to travel faster than light. It would take the most advanced Enterprise ship(1701-E) more or less a hundred years to travel from one end of your galaxy to the other.

the hyperdrives on StarWars ships actually 'pushes' the craft itself into another dimention, called 'hyperspace'. So the space craft pretty mutch leaves the 'normal' dimention. Because distance doesn't work the same way in 'hyperspace', an average ship can travel from one end of their galaxy to the other in a couple of weeks-more or less.

So from a certain point of view, because StarWars ships use 'hyperspace' to travel, they are actually faster than Trek ships.
 
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