Possible Homeworld2 WC mod

C

Chicken

Spaceman
Right now I'm kinda of toying around with a possible idea for a mod based on Wing Commander 2-3 for use in Homeworld 2, which is a far superior product to work with than the first. However, I think it would be a good idea to prop a 'working title' for now. Just wanna know some opinions on such a possible project.

If more interest is generated in it, then I'll start to work on more stuff for it.
 
I am interested.
I allways liked HW2 and I think it would be a quite good engine to do some WC Fleetbattles or don't know if its possible do some scenarios like the Battle for Earth.
Its supports fighters, torpedos/capmissiles and could if the balanceing is right be a very good startingpoint for doing a mod.

Also do you have any experiance in HW2 modding or some people who does...a team is allways helpfull in doing mods ^_^

About the titel...well if you can do a scenario with some missions to play I would aim for a titel that is fitting to the story.
If you need some ideas...well I think their where posted some over at the WC Saga forum.

Something that came up to my mind was something like WC: Homedefance.
Don't know why but it was beside Fleetbattles (think something similar is allready taken) the first thing that I thought while reading your post.
 
Hmm... here's a stab at a couple at titles:

Wing Commander: Armada Unleashed
Wing Commander: Fleet Command
Homeworld2: WC Frontline

Possibly something with Fleet Commander

Well, it looks like I've hit a name! Personally WC Fleet Commander holds a bit of appeal to it.

I'm learning how to mod in Homeworld2, but I'm gonna get the Relic Tools soon so I can actually start playing with the in game stuff. I've some knowledge of 3D design with Maya and 3ds Max, but I've painfully learned that modeling is not my best strength. Since I am crazy enough, I'll try to see if I can learn the tips and tricks to create single-player levels in Homeworld2, but still multiplayer has the charm of sheer destruction and broken egos between players.

Let me just say that the main focus of a possible mod will be multiplayer between Confed and the Kilrathi, though I wouldn't be surprised if I expanded it to include more races and other types of gameplay.
 
Fleet Action was the name of the Homeworld 1 WC mod, but names are really one of the last concerns of fan projects.
 
WC: Battleforces might be another one.
But what I think is more importend then a Titel...you could still change it later...is to have something to show..a concept of what you plan to do would be good.
I mean more then the I want WCships in it.
Maybe starting with a list of what ships you want ingame for what purpose...if you want to add new music tracks...things like that.

About the singleplayer/multiplayer part...if you can find out how to do missions it would be great to have some special battle like "Battle for earth" or things like that...but its totaly ok for me when you just make it a multiplayer game...you still should be able to play the original HW2 campain with the WC ships.
Did that with a B5 mod for HW1...was quite funny.
 
It would be cool to have no production capability of any sort, just a carrier with escorts and a full fighter complement, and you'd have to do with that over a whole campaign. Though I'd imagine that wouldn't be easy.
 
I think "Nexus" did a good thing by giving you resources just at the end of the mission so that you have to fight the missions with you have.

I don't know if its possible...maybe you could turn off the resourcecollecting and have a fixed income over time...from that you could buy ships....or you just get credits at the end/beginning of a mission so you can build stuff for the next mission.
Other thing for multiplayer could be to have a startingmoney...both players build up their fleet and then battle it out.
Could be interesting.


I think that could be a workaround for a campain without the need to modifiy the sourcecode.
 
What my concept is?

Here's a loose concept:
The mod will seek to concentrate on strategic gameplay, as opposed to just harvesting resources or throwing as many ships at the enemy as possible. The depth of gameplay was nice and subsystems made the combat funner during multiplayer (I often left my enemies with crippled ships). The enigne allows for a lot of improvement to the gameplay, as you don't need to replace existing ships in the game like HW1.

Gameplay style(s):

Capships only, no fighters or carriers, so watch that Fralthi II and Tallahasee lay the smack down on one another as destroyers and frigates pop into brilliant light shows.

Carrier based combat will be very important, carriers will serve as the spearhead during assualts and fighters will serve as the primary weapon of the fleets.

No resourcing in some gametypes, forcing players to utilize their existing fleet to its fullest potential.

Races:

Terran Confederation: The Confed forces are built around a jack of all trades approach, allowing their ships to perform multiple tasks and serving as stop gaps in bad times. Some elements of the fleet however, are a designed for raiding, such as the infamous Escort Carriers that raided Kilrah or Vukar Tag. This flexiblity serves as an advantage and weakness. On the downside, Confed vessels, such as carriers, take longer to build than the Kilrathi.

Kilrathi Empire: Unlike the Confederation, the Kilrathi specialize in one simple mission: Total offensive ass kicking. Simply put the Kilrathi place much emphasis on firepower over defense. While they're fighters are not so great as Confed's, they have more capital ships and can produce them faster, allowing the Kilrathi to pack in as many ships in a battle as possible.

Shiplist...? I'll need to work on this, but rest assured, the Confederation class Dreadnought will not be left out!

Edit: Added some stuff.
 
Gameplay:
Since in the original HW2 all or most of them...where build by your Mothership. Do you intend to use something similar or do you give the player just a Carrier to start with and later a constructionship that builds other capships?
Other possibility could be to have a Starbase with a construction facility connected to it.
Whatever you do I think it will be interesting how to solve the "I kill you with mass" aspect of the game.

Other thing is what feeling you would give the game....special thinking about damage. For example in WC3 you could takeout 2 Kilrathi ships with a Longbow alone.
In the novels we see its quite harder to do so. Question is what do you want. Long battles or quick strikes.
Personly I prefer the longer battles where you can see caps exchaning salvos with each other while the fighters try to protect it.

Races:
Interesting idea to give them these characters..would make multiplayer more interesting.

Shiplist:
Just thought it would be funny if you have a campain that starts during..lets say WC2 timeline. While you improve your technologie you can build more and more modern ships....but since you are aiming for a multiplayer I think it would be best to have a fixed timeline instead of jumping between them...would also solve a lot of trouble with comparing stats of the different timelines.
 
I could actually use some ideas for a mothership class vessel, frankly I don't know what would be good. I'd probably use a starbase for a shipyard.

In terms of firepower, I want to make it harder for fighters to kill capships, so it would take a couple of runs to whack a capital ship. Another reason is so that the ship lasts longer and players could instead frag the engines with the bombers and let a heavier ship like a cruiser finish it off with a capship missile. Let's use a frigate for example, so if a bomber would fire a torpedo: a) in normal WC2-4 the frigate would burn and go Boom! b) in Homeworld2 the frigate would take at least four or five torpedoes before dying. I prefer having the capships take more of a beating before going down in a fiery ball of death.

Another idea I want to add damage caused by a capital ship exploding, destroying nearyby fighters or heavily damaging them. A similar effect would happen with closely clustered capital ships, there'd be heavy damage and lots of burning fires.

I'm still thinking of more ideas... but let me know of what you guys out there think.
 
Something cool would be instead of beeing build by a spaceyard or construction ship would be if capships just jump into the system near your main carrier and fighters would be brought by a transport, but I don't think that this is possible without some modifications of the sourcecode.

About what to use as startingpoint....well I would use a construction-class vessel and some fighters.
For resources...well you could start with a fixed budget and then build your fleet and then face the enemy. Other thing is that I would actualy keep some part of the resourcescollecting part, but reduce it quite a lot compared to HW2 so that you realy have to relay on your choosen tactic and see if you can get through with it.
The additional resources should be their to give you a little chance to react on the enemys movements.
Also ships where salvageable in HW2...I would still use that since if you changed the fate of a battle and don't have any other resources it could become quite anoying to know that you will loose just because you don't get any other resources.

Firepower:
I like your idea, hope it could be done this way.

Explosiondamage:
I don't know, but if its possible I would like to see an EMP rather then a heavy damaging shockwave....but on the other hand it would make the use if a combined force more necessary...cause you can't just beat up caps with fighters without risking heavy looses to your squads.
Is it also possible to give ships a subsystem that you can dissable their weapons and then capture the ship? Would be a nice option to have for gameplay...would like to see a Fralthi II turning around and engage other Kilrathi.
 
chicken <<

have you edited homeworld 1 before?

if you need a homeworld 1 setup to see how it was done there, i can send you the entire fleet action folder of work, before i stopped working on it.

it's a clean setup, very little junk in there. you could posibly learn off of it.

homeworld2 is supposed to be easier to edit than hw1. so if you can get hw1, you can get hw2.

-scheherazade
 
I would be excited to see a Wing Commander HW2 mod. Even when playing the game, I would often imagine it as Confed Vs. Kilrathi. There are places where you can download some nice WC badges for the ships. Some ideas:
You may not need to put the title as HW2:"..." because alot of mods are simply labled Wing Commander followed by the name of the game and a description of what mod it is. i.e. Wing Commander: The Admiral's Command (A HW2 Mod.)
I like the idea of downplaying the amount and importance of resourcing ops. This is an aspect of the game that didn't seem very WC. Some resourcing might be good though- you could use transports in place of resource collectors and have to escort them like in the WC games. Maybe instead of harvesting at rocks, the transports could jump in and out of jump points and return with reinforcements (i.e. replacement fighters, etc..). I like your idea of set resources to build your fleet, and possibly also to determine amount and types of reinforcements that you could order to come through the jump point (maybe during certain points in the game, you'll receive more resources which represent amt. of reinforcements you can order from Fleet Command). However, if you don't want to wait for more available ships from Confed/Kilrah, you can send a transport through to bring back a fighter/bomber squadron(s).
Playing the campaign of WC3, related events (Like WC Saga), or a combination from an Admiral's perspective would be fun. Having elite bombers/fighters like in the HW2 campaign (elite bombers and gunships) could represent ace squadrons like Bloodmist/Maniac/etc..
 
As far as construction class vessels: if you're looking for a shipyard, WC Saga has a beautiful Kilrathi shipyard screenshot on their forums. For a mothership, it could be the starbase like the one Tolwyn was in at the start of WC3. Or it could be a high classed carrier. I like the idea of caring more for the cap ships you have, because it wouldn't make much sense in the WC universe to have cap ships being built from scratch in a matter of mere seconds like they are in HW2 (although they could be ordered up as reinforcements that quickly or built more slowly).
Other Title ideas:
Wing Commander: Admiral's Chair (A HW2 mod) Wing Commander: Ace of Admirals ....
WC: Fate In Your Hands (a reference to Tolwyn in WC3: "I hold the fate of the Confederation in my hands")
 
I'm playing around with the Relic Tools right now and modifying ships for entertaining results... who new a squadron of interceptors coud knock a Vagyr ship (battlecruiser) in one hit when you make'em do a a million points of damage. I've been also talking with some friends about forming a small mod team, but we're still talking.

I'm also working a partial ship list for the Confederation now:

Strikecraft:

WC2 Ships
  • Recon/Light Fighter: Ferret
  • Medium Fighter : Rapier
  • Heavy Fighter: Sabre
  • Super Fighter: Morningstar
  • Bomber: Broadsword
  • Bomber 2: Crossbow
  • Frigate 1: Caernaven stylized to meet WC2
  • Frigate: Custom/Non-Canon Gywnedd Class

Kind of what I've got in mind for, though I'm always up for more suggestions.
 
:( Unfortunately I've never played WC's 1 and 2, so I couldn't enjoy any of those very much. Which ones have you played? Well, I can only hope for WC's 3 and 4 (3 would be my 1st choice). Of course this is just me personally, and many people have played only 1 and/or 2 and not the later ones- so they may not enjoy the 3 and 4 timeline either. I wonder if a mix is a possibility? Maybe not because many WC1 fighters would be out of date from the WC3/4 timelines? Well, this would be my wish list:
Confed....................................................................Kilrathi
Recon/Light Fighter: Arrow..........................................R/LF: Darket
Medium Fighter: Hellcat...............................................MedF: Dralthi
Heavy Fighter: Thunderbolt.........................................HF: Vaktoth (or Sorthak)
Super Fighter: Excalibur...............................................SF: Bloodfang
Bomber: Longbow..........................................................B: Paktahn
Frigates: Destroyer/Tallahassee/Caernaven...........Fs: Destroyer/Fralthi II/Corvette
Carrier: Ranger Class (Victory)..................................Carrier: Bhantkara Carrier
Battlecruiser: Vesuvius/Dreadnought Class Carrier..........BC: Kilrathi Dreadnought
 
What about cloacked fighter tech can it work in HW2 or did Relic take that out. If so could it be added.

Btw is it me or did HW2 loose some good ideas from HW1. Like weapon research or ship ideas as Taiidan "Qwaar-Jet" Heavy Cruiser, Taiidan "Kudaark" Assault Frigate, Leech, Sentinel, Hive Swarmer, Multi-Beam Frigate & Hive Frigate. Another thing they could have lfet some of the old ships but upgraded them a bit it would have been nice to see Battlecruiser fight along side with Kushan Heavy Cruiser.
 
Unfortunately I've never played WC's 1 and 2, so I couldn't enjoy any of those very much. Which ones have you played? Well, I can only hope for WC's 3 and 4 (3 would be my 1st choice). Of course this is just me personally, and many people have played only 1 and/or 2 and not the later ones- so they may not enjoy the 3 and 4 timeline either. I wonder if a mix is a possibility? Maybe not because many WC1 fighters would be out of date from the WC3/4 timelines? Well, this would be my wish list:
Confed........................................ ............................Kilrathi
Recon/Light Fighter: Arrow................................... .......R/LF: Darket
Medium Fighter: Hellcat................................. ..............MedF: Dralthi
Heavy Fighter: Thunderbolt............................. ............HF: Vaktoth (or Sorthak)
Super Fighter: Excalibur............................... ................SF: Bloodfang
Bomber: Longbow................................. .........................B: Paktahn
Frigates: Destroyer/Tallahassee/Caernaven...........Fs: Destroyer/Fralthi II/Corvette
Carrier: Ranger Class (Victory)............................... ...Carrier: Bhantkara Carrier
Battlecruiser: Vesuvius/Dreadnought Class Carrier..........BC: Kilrathi Dreadnought
Click to expand...

Cool list. I was actually thinking about having all the WC 2-4 Ships, and other vessels like the Jutland attack carrier and Savannah light cruiser that was developed for WC Saga. It's quite a big list, but I wouldn't mind having the extra vessels. Depending if time and reality hold true, then I'll plan on using Fleet Tactics (the kick ass site) as a guide to the ship list and future plans for more vessels.

What about cloacked fighter tech can it work in HW2 or did Relic take that out. If so could it be added.

Btw is it me or did HW2 loose some good ideas from HW1. Like weapon research or ship ideas as Taiidan "Qwaar-Jet" Heavy Cruiser, Taiidan "Kudaark" Assault Frigate, Leech, Sentinel, Hive Swarmer, Multi-Beam Frigate & Hive Frigate. Another thing they could have lfet some of the old ships but upgraded them a bit it would have been nice to see Battlecruiser fight along side with Kushan Heavy Cruiser.
Click to expand...

You can have cloaked fighters in HW2, but you need to probably stick a cloaking module on the fighter. I agree that some good ideas were lost from HW1, but that's where modding comes into play!

I'm also looking at some other HW2 mods for ideas, one of which is Point Defense Systems, but it slows my computer down a lot because of all the extra modules that come with the ships. Also might be an excuse for me to get a new video card too.

Hmm...I actually wouldn't mind adding the Border Worlds and Firekkans to the fireworks. Also the Nephilim always serve as another enemy, and that would bring Prophecy and Secret Ops ships into play. And a final note, the one ship that you'll most likely not see me touch is the Wraith - I personally hate its look and reminds of a bloated pumpkin with wings. I'd rather some or else me create a new and sleek Wraith design instead of the original.
 
Chicken said:
You can have cloaked fighters in HW2, but you need to probably stick a cloaking module on the fighter.
Click to expand...
Well, that's what it was like for Confed at the time (and even Border Worlds in WC4). They had to use cloaking as an add-on to certain ships that normally didn't cloak (Excalibur+Tweaks by Pliers). Of course the Strakha is ALWAYS cloaked, but maybe it can come out of the factory (or whatever process you use to create/add ships) with the module ALWAYS on it? Micromanaging in a furball would be lost, but it might prove handy when sneaking up on resource ops/modules/etc. or escaping a losing battle in order to repair at a carrier.
Chicken said:
Hmm...I actually wouldn't mind adding the Border Worlds and Firekkans to the fireworks. Also the Nephilim always serve as another enemy, and that would bring Prophecy and Secret Ops ships into play.
Click to expand...
That would be SWEET! Do HW2 mods support the choice of more than 2 races? Sounds like a huge undertaking though, any luck finding someone to help? I wish I could, but I'm not computer saavy and have no experience with mods. In addition to looking on WC sites, you might find someone on HW2 sites who might be interested in working with you (maybe someone who's made a good HW2 mod already if you're lucky). Well, I REALLY wish you success in this!
 
While I was brainstorming for some ideas for a possible single player campaign, I though it'd be cool to tell the story from the side of the Kilrathi rebels, the Firekkans, or the Border Worlds. I was writing about my idea when I found somebody had already posted about: What happened to Ghorah Khar?, and bam all the sudden I have an ambitious idea! Talk about strange coincidences...

It would be pretty cool to have a single player campaign about the rebels of Ghorah Khar and their struggle for survival between the time of the Truce in 2668 to the end of WC 3. Thinking of the campaign, the player would begin with a lonely fleet consisting of a modified Fralthi and a handful of Sartha running with their tails (no pun intended) from Ghorah Khar and by the end would be commanding a formidable force of Kilrathi and Confed warships to retake their captured homeworld during Confed's Long Shot operation, as most of the Kilrathi fleet would be drawn up around Kilrah before it's destruction by the temblor bomb.
________________________________________________________________________

As for other notes, I've decided to simplify the amount of material that mod would have, consisting of a single player campaign if possible, and featuring the races of Confed, Kilrathi, Ghorah Khar Rebels, Firekkans, and plausible Border Worlds (I'm still working on them) for multiplayer and CPU skirmish games.
 
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