codenames for DRT & flashpack

Erkle said:
p.s. the shuttle expels a gas for moving such as co2, they can do that because there is no friction or resistence. The fuel used for the engines is water, yes water. Through electrolosys (sp?) the oxygen and hydrogen are seperated giving the crew oxygen to breathe and hydrogen for fuel.

Actually, the main engines burn the H2 and O2. About the only place where I would suggest you'd see simple 'gas-release = thrust' engines would be on something like a broomstick or similar one-person device used for low-velocity maneuvering in zero-g, say during space-based construction.
 
Filler said:
Sensors would be useless otherwise, right?

Not useless. Most of the time on WC the objects on your radar can be spotted by the naked eye, but they are still useful to track multiple bogies on a dogfight. So, it's still useful when that happens. But LOAF's affirmations ir right, of course.
 
Hey, maybe, for his silly ideas that make us all laugh, we should give him the rank of "Clown" . . . or "assclown" . . . or maybe "Ass Hat". I dunno . . . maybe something more creative.
 
Haesslich said:
Actually, the main engines burn the H2 and O2. About the only place where I would suggest you'd see simple 'gas-release = thrust' engines would be on something like a broomstick or similar one-person device used for low-velocity maneuvering in zero-g, say during space-based construction.


:( Oops my mistake, sorry.... at least I was kinda close.... time to commit suicide again....

Jim
 
overmortal said:
Hey, maybe, for his silly ideas that make us all laugh, we should give him the rank of "Clown" . . . or "assclown" . . . or maybe "Ass Hat". I dunno . . . maybe something more creative.

I don't remember a time when 'ass' anything was witty.
 
Actually, you're ALL wrong (about the shuttle, anyway). The shuttle has about three major propulsion systems. The main engines (which are used to get into orbit, and ONLY to get into orbit) require a huge massive liquid oxygen/hydrogen tank to get into orbit, along with the two solid rocket boosters which use some sort of aluminum-based rubbery compound (I forget exactly which, but I'm sure a quick Google would turn it up). So much for requiring piddling amounts of fuel to get into/out of orbit.

To manuever, the shuttle mainly uses nitrogen gas. It's inert and safe, and good enough to change orientation. Space walkers also use nitrogen gas in their manuevering units. The gas is basically just blown out under pressure, which makes it quite reliable.

For major manuevers (like deorbit), the space shuttle uses a hypergolic fuel (hydrazine, I think) in the OMS (orbital manuevering units), those two bulbous pods in the back, near the vertical stabilizer (rudder fin). Basically, hydrazine is a self-igniting fuel, which is why it's useful for the deorbiting stage: it eliminates the possibility that the ignition system might fail. It's not as safe as nitrogen gas, however.

Now, the OMS doesn't produce thrust equal to that to get the shuttle into orbit; that's just ridiculous. The purpose of the OMS is to slow down the shuttle enough that shuttle loses enough energy to drop into the upper atmosphere, which then slows the shuttle down the rest of the way to the ground (I suppose you could call this the "fourth" propulsion system).

If the shuttle did have enough fuel for powered flight both ways, it wouldn't need a sophisticated thermal protection sytem, because it could simply fly down in a reverse course to the lift-off (Buck Rogers-style). However, it wouldn't simply require double the fuel, but many times more, because you'd have to lift all that fuel into orbit, along with the fuel tank, and whatever else. The main engines aren't even designed to fire twice--they have to be overhauled after each mission.

I think an experimental spacecraft, DC-X, might have been capable of vertical ascent/descent, but it was only a prototype. It worked fairly well, but fell over and caught fire because somebody skimped on the landing leg design. I don't know what the fuel numbers were like; the idea behind vertical ascent/descent is mainly one of convenience (same reason why helicopters are more appropriate than airplanes in certain applications).

To return to blackfuel, I think we must be talking about oil. It is a fuel, and it is black. Ergo, black fuel. Holy smokes, fossil fuel-powered fighters, Batman.
 
GeeBot said:
To manuever, the shuttle mainly uses nitrogen gas. It's inert and safe, and good enough to change orientation. Space walkers also use nitrogen gas in their manuevering units. The gas is basically just blown out under pressure, which makes it quite reliable.

For major manuevers (like deorbit), the space shuttle uses a hypergolic fuel (hydrazine, I think) in the OMS (orbital manuevering units), those two bulbous pods in the back, near the vertical stabilizer (rudder fin). Basically, hydrazine is a self-igniting fuel, which is why it's useful for the deorbiting stage: it eliminates the possibility that the ignition system might fail. It's not as safe as nitrogen gas, however.

That's still a reaction drive, with the hydrazine - you have to burn it to get the thrust. And I thought they used helium in the lower-thrust squirters, myself. Major maneuvers do, as you've noted, need to burn fuel.

GeeBot said:
To return to blackfuel, I think we must be talking about oil. It is a fuel, and it is black. Ergo, black fuel. Holy smokes, fossil fuel-powered fighters, Batman.

Joshua's statement in a previous thread gives lie to yours:

Joshua said:
And how would the Kilrathi be able to see my energy emissions? If I use blackfuel like from Star Adventure 4010 game, they won't be able to see any emissions because the blackfuel exhaust would blend in with the blackness of space. In Star Adventure 4010, blackfuel is pumped into chambers but they're not combustion chambers -- the blackfuel is then exited out of the chambers in a manner similar to air exiting out of a balloon -- the exiting of fuel pushes the ship forward.

He seems to think the shuttle doesn't BURN any of its fuel, in either the hydrazine or the main engines, but rather just squirts it out the back, or releases it out the back, which provides thrust. Look at the 'air exiting out of a balloon' example he gives.
 
Definition from Google!Groups:

Black Death - AKA black fuel - is caused by a bacterial waste product from an organism that grows on the interface between oil and water. It is the same bacteria that was used to "clean up" the oil spilled in major oil spills such as the EXXON Valdez. The bacteria is present everywhere - the water is normally missing from Diesel. No air is necessary.
 
I wasn't seriously trying to figure out what the black fuel was... I was trying to make a mockery of fossil-fueled fighters. But alas, the oil theory didn't hold water.

I never denied that hydrazine burned, or that any of the three propulsion systems were reaction drives... I was just making a pedantic point, and wanted to dispel the notion that lox-hydrogen was used for everything.

BTW, I'm pretty sure it's nitrogen, but this is all of the top of my head. I should probably look it up to make sure.
 
Isn't coal black?

Perhaps, this blackfuel is simply coal and the cloaking effect is from the smoke that comes from burning coal. And a side result is acid rain over planets in which the coal-powered ships fly.

Also the surprise must come from seeing antiquated propulsion systems in space...
 
Maybe it's cola, such as pepsi or coke . . . you shake up the fuel tank and let it spew you across space . . . effective and delicious!
 
Hey, all this thinking about blackfuel made me think about whitefuel... some properties of whitefuel could include counteracting the effects of blackfuel, so you can spot invisible ships at 5000 light years away and go from 0 to 60 in 1 microsecond. Hey, Confed should have fought the war smarter. I bet if they had used whitefuel, they wouldn't have been surprised by the Kilrathi cloaks, and they would have won faster. Yeah.
 
Whitefuel supremecy groups... the Kilrathi Krushing Klan. George Washington says fuel racism is bad.
 
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