Carrier Landing Styles

Expendable said:
Well, wouldn't the thrusters sear the crew and damage equipment/parked fighters?

Not if they were expelling rather 'harmless' gases - you wouldn't need the high-energy stuff to maneuver or slow down in atmosphere, where you've got drag to consider, on top of what the airshield'll do to your speed. Besides, that's what the ACLS and tractor beams are for.

The main reason he didn't want to use thrusters in there was because it'd affect his landing, IIRC; on page 68, it notes that the deck was 'too tight' for a last squirt from thrusters - in other words, he was more concerned with colliding with something after braking with the thrusters and being pushed to one side (or up), or so I interpreted that last statement.

And as far as Antman goes... he needs to read End Run. There's a reason that the tractor beam being used on a fighter doesn't send the capship employing it squirting meters in the other direction - the strength of a beam that'll pull a fighter in several kilometers will only pull the carrier a meter or so towards the other craft.
Antman said:
But, since all forces have an opposite and equal reaction, when I take off, shouldnt that push the victory backwards?

yes 100% and so is Viper

momentum : mass(fighter) x velocity(fighter) = mass(carrier) x velocity (carrier)

so the relative difference in speed (with the carrier moving back), is insignificant next to the weight of the craft in terms of energy exchanged.

come on man, i hope you are real young, cos thats HS physics.. heh :p
Why would scoops slow down the fighter, while it is ON the carrier, inside its gravity field, to slower then the carrier?
Antman said:
Why would scoops slow down the fighter, while it is ON the carrier, inside its gravity field, to slower then the carrier?

If I'm reading this right, you're asking why the scoops slow you down once you hit space, upon launching off a deck? Or do you mean when you're landed already, your wheels on the deck itself? If it's the former, read on. If it's the latter...


When you get past atmosphere (aka the airshields), the scoops are on to provide a) fuel and b) drag. That drag brings you back down to a relatively low velocity compared to the carrier. The catapults let you get the fighter out of the bay quickly, so you can shoot the next one out after it without waiting for the guy to accelerate using burners or engines. Once you hit space, the scoops slow you down - so rolling out of the hangar as the ship moves forward would provide you with the same velocity relative to the carrier, but once the scoops hit space... your speed relative to the carrier drops, and said carrier rams you up the ass.

Freedom Flight has Hunter talking about why they use catapults and clearing turns to get off the Claw - one guy who failed to turn left or right, had his engines fail following scoop field activation. The Claw ran RIGHT into him, and left less than a spoonful of the fighter to bury. There was even less left of the pilot. And that was WITH a catapult to give him a few extra ms or kps extra speed.
Antman said:
Why would scoops slow down the fighter, while it is ON the carrier, inside its gravity field, to slower then the carrier?
Scoops take in stray hydrogen from space IIRC for fuel and manuevering. Hydrogen content in space is supposedly known to be between 1 atom/cubic centimeter and 1000 atoms/cubic centimeter, depending on how close to the galactic core you are. Hydrogen density in atmosphere may contain higher than 30 billion billion (no thats apparently not a typo :)) atoms per cubic centimeter. If you want to take off from a carrier with an atmosphere and scoops full open, its gonna require some significant thrust or a catapult. :)

Edit: I can't find another source to back up that the 30 quadrillion atoms/cubic centimeter is hydrogen or air in general. If its air in general, that still leaves 1.5 x10^15 atoms/cubic centimeter of hydrogen in atmosphere ;).

Earths atmosphere is 78% Nitrogen and 21% oxygen, ever wonder what that other 1% is? Argon, neon, and other gases (including hydrogen) makes up that other 1%
H(subscript)2 makes up 0.0005% the earths atmosphere.

I'm not gonna spend anymore time arguing this . . . read a HS science book or just Google search "earth atmosphere percentage" and maybe throw "hydrogen gas" in there.

There is no such thing as a 'HS Science Book', unless you mean any science book, therefore, I will read by biology book from 2 years back...
Erm, you added the capitalization - nowhere did Viper imply that he actually thought that there was a book called "HS Science Book". He even said 'a'.

There's no such thing as a bagel.
lol, at the scoop explaination.. and all this time i didnt know that there was significant "drag" in space... cos that sorta requires an atmosphere...
Not really - space isn't a total vacuum... when you have an electromagnetic scoop large enough (... to power a spaceship), you'll get some form of drag.
i'm intrigued by the Electromagnetic nature... do you think this colludes to form another type of drag?

yes it isnt a total vacuum, but close nuff such that rocks impact our atmosphere at thousands of km/h travelling from other solar system with nothing other than being imparted inital momentum. or that satellites are kept in orbit without lateral propulsion etc etc...

scoops i feel would create "some form of drag" but not near enough to create a significant difference in speed from the fighter relative to the carrier, not enought to get smashed into bits from a rear collision either, although we do know that mass is a signifcant force in space from small debris damage to space shuttles.
stupid idea of the moment: Engines should provide a fairly painful blast to whatever is caught in their path, so would it be possible (in Maniac's R+D squad, not for mass use) to have an engine nozzle facing forward that provides the "oh shit" braking power and torches the enemy you are tailing too close all at once? (perfect accessory for Maj. Marshall there...)
If it weren't for the "stupid idea" disclaimer, I think you'd have probably been flamed for that. :p

As is, however, I don't think that engines would provide that much damage . . . or range. You'd have to be life-threateningly close to do what you're suggesting.
When you kill the thrusters your speed drops off pretty darn quick, and a WC book I had said something about, fighters having braking thrusters as well.

In End Run IIRC, Bear has to shut his scoops down when flying in atmosphere, because they generate to much drag. They probably catch more than just hydrogen, and have to filter through an intake or something. I dunno, physics and chemistry were many moons ago.