What one thing do you want to see most in UE2?
- Thread starter Pedro
- Start date
Quarto
Unknown Enemy
As far as we know, it's impossible to change object properties, which is a damned pity (it would be awesome if a dead capship could be replaced with a 'wreck' version). Who knows, it might be possible for HCl to implement a command which does this.
As for the straight out capship battles, I think that they could be useful in situations like the WC2 destroyer escort missions, where you took a destroyer into combat against an enemy capital ship. In such a situation, it is conceivable that there could be two different mission branches depending on who won the battle, and it certainly would be easy enough to ensure that the player has an influence over the fight (to begin with, every turret he takes out would reduce the amount of fire going against the friendly capship).
As for the straight out capship battles, I think that they could be useful in situations like the WC2 destroyer escort missions, where you took a destroyer into combat against an enemy capital ship. In such a situation, it is conceivable that there could be two different mission branches depending on who won the battle, and it certainly would be easy enough to ensure that the player has an influence over the fight (to begin with, every turret he takes out would reduce the amount of fire going against the friendly capship).
HCl
WC EXE archaeologist
Well, i can't think of a simple way to change the ship object property in that way... However, if you're looking into wreck versions for dead capships, it'd be simple to create a new interpreter function (DLL patch) that would position a given object on the same position and orientation as another object. This way, on the capship death function you could call deactivateship, copy the position and orientation in world space to the wreck and activate the wreck.
The leech function solution you mentioned would work, since Leech functions work on capship hulls. On the other hand, if you wanted to use it on components, it might not work without modification (the new Leech functions were created for fighters originally).
The leech function solution you mentioned would work, since Leech functions work on capship hulls. On the other hand, if you wanted to use it on components, it might not work without modification (the new Leech functions were created for fighters originally).
Eder
Mr. Standoff
Hmmm. That's another thing that could be improved upon if every capship was a single component... but then the 1200 poly limit would have to be more strictly respected, since any 'part' structures that might eventually be attached to the main thing to cheat on that limit can't be replaced with damaged versions.
--Eder
Quarto
Unknown Enemy
Hmm... actually, placing another ship in the same spot as a capship would be fairly easy to do even without special functions, now that I think about it 
. As long as they matched up scale-wise, probably the only problem would be a slight slow-down for the few milliseconds when both ships are present at the same time.
. But then again, if the leech solution requires the capships to use guns not used by anything else, then it would be easy enough to also make those particular gun types deal damage to components.
And Eder, I don't think any ship in the original WCP even approached the 1200 limit.
. As long as they matched up scale-wise, probably the only problem would be a slight slow-down for the few milliseconds when both ships are present at the same time.Hehe, the irony - so if the capship actually *hit* the other capship's components, that would cause problems
. But then again, if the leech solution requires the capships to use guns not used by anything else, then it would be easy enough to also make those particular gun types deal damage to components.And Eder, I don't think any ship in the original WCP even approached the 1200 limit
.
HCl
WC EXE archaeologist
Hmm... actually, placing another ship in the same spot as a capship would be fairly easy to do even without special functions, now that I think about it
Well yes, assuming that both the capship and the wreck are facing the same direction... but if the capship needed to turn for some reason it wouldn't be enough to change the x,y,z coordinates of the wreck, you'd need to update the wreck direction (orienation matrix) with the ship's at death time, otherwise you'd get the wreck facing a different way.
Quarto
Unknown Enemy
Hmm, a good point. Would a HCL_GetDirection(ship) function be possible? Since there already is a HCL_ChangeDirection, that would be enough. I don't think there are any WCP functions which output more than a single variable, though, so this would probably have to be done as three functions - GetDirectionX, Y, and Z (the way SO's position checking SF_GetX, Y, Z functions work).
HCl
WC EXE archaeologist
Well, an interpreter function can only (iirc) return one value, an HCL_GetDirection would need to return 3 values (3 rotation angles), so it'd be difficult. I would suggest a function HCL_CopyDirection(obj) or HCL_CopyDirection (obj, obj), which would be very simple to do
(edit)
I'd like to avoid 3 functions that return an angle each due to matrix to angle conversion, which is why i suggested the CopyDirection function instead. I'm working on creating a fan-project-independent DLL with the functions and modifications made so far, i'll be adding the direction function we agree on and putting up a first version relatively soon.
(edit)
I'd like to avoid 3 functions that return an angle each due to matrix to angle conversion, which is why i suggested the CopyDirection function instead. I'm working on creating a fan-project-independent DLL with the functions and modifications made so far, i'll be adding the direction function we agree on and putting up a first version relatively soon.
Eder
Mr. Standoff
Originally posted by Quarto
And Eder, I don't think any ship in the original WCP even approached the 1200 limit
Who cares about the original WCP, though?
Almost all of my capships are over that limit - the CVE has about 1400 faces, the Waterloo has 1600, etc. so it'd be a hell of a lot of trouble to re-do them to try these techniques out. A lot more trouble than fixing a certain space station for the nth time --Eder
Quarto
Unknown Enemy
Hmm... well, you could make it consist of two or three components. If you used a hangar or a launcher component, for example, you reduce the poly count of the main mesh without increasing the damage required, because those components die automatically when the rest of the ship gets nuked. And pretty much every one of your capships has a hangar, right?
. KW says that the problems might be caused by the mesh not being completely closed.
Which, incidentally, didn't work againOriginally posted by Eder
A lot more trouble than fixing a certain space station for the nth time
. KW says that the problems might be caused by the mesh not being completely closed.
.furless_freak
Spaceman
hello i am new here and i love the mod you are making for secret ops and i want to ask a few questions
1. what new or old ships from the past WC games are in UE all i know is there is a bengal in UE
2. do kilrathi faces appear in comm messages in UE to represent anything kilrathi?
3. Does Confed Assist you in UE?
4 are there any ground missions in UE?
5 Do the Pilots have callsigns instead of wingmen numbers like Zeta 1
6 which mission do you encounter Nephilim for the first time?
thank you that is all
1. what new or old ships from the past WC games are in UE all i know is there is a bengal in UE
2. do kilrathi faces appear in comm messages in UE to represent anything kilrathi?
3. Does Confed Assist you in UE?
4 are there any ground missions in UE?
5 Do the Pilots have callsigns instead of wingmen numbers like Zeta 1
6 which mission do you encounter Nephilim for the first time?
thank you that is all
Quarto
Unknown Enemy
1. Plenty of old ships - Scims, Banshees, Epees, Bearcats, Ferrets, Avengers, the Intrepid, several Kilrathi ships and two or three old capships that appear only in cutscenes. And of course, the Bengal-class.
2. Just about, yes. For capships, and that includes Kilrathi capships, comm messages show a rotating logo of the faction that owns the ship (ie., BW logo for BW ships, Kat logo for Kilrathi ships, and Confed for Confed ships; bugs are the same as in WCP).
3. They do, but only if you fight well enough.
4. No ground missions. They're not really supported by SO, and though there are ways of simulating ground missions, they were only developed when we were about half-way through UE.
5. Most of the time, yes.
6. They appear a few missions after the start of the game.
2. Just about, yes. For capships, and that includes Kilrathi capships, comm messages show a rotating logo of the faction that owns the ship (ie., BW logo for BW ships, Kat logo for Kilrathi ships, and Confed for Confed ships; bugs are the same as in WCP).
3. They do, but only if you fight well enough
.4. No ground missions. They're not really supported by SO, and though there are ways of simulating ground missions, they were only developed when we were about half-way through UE.
5. Most of the time, yes.
6. They appear a few missions after the start of the game.
Damn, I can hardly wait. A new set of WC combat missions is always good, but the fact that it's set in (and about) the Border Worlds is the icing on the cake.
PS: When UE is released, I can put out a news release to the Aces (I run the club's mailing list) letting them know about it. If you guys have a specific message you want to go out, just mail it to me at theraj@es.co.nz, and I'll send it on.
PPS: I noticed the Vindicator was absent from that ships list. Don't tell me the Vindicator Cult has to start breaking out the shotguns....
Best, Raptor
PS: When UE is released, I can put out a news release to the Aces (I run the club's mailing list) letting them know about it. If you guys have a specific message you want to go out, just mail it to me at theraj@es.co.nz, and I'll send it on.
PPS: I noticed the Vindicator was absent from that ships list. Don't tell me the Vindicator Cult has to start breaking out the shotguns....
Best, Raptor
Actually, on balance, the thing I'd most like to see in UE2 are regular website updates, as seen in UE1. Even when there is little to report, its still good to know that the project is actually still alive. On the same note, it's good that there are individuals involved who are able to keep the project going and the various contributers co-ordinated. So thanks to Pedro, Quarto and everyone involved!
I'm full of ideas tonight
If you decide to add any brand new ships to UE2 it might be worth adding some ex-confed corvettes. I know there are references to them in the literature (in the WCP Lit if nothing else). They are meant to be a cheap solution (quicker and cheaper than a capship but with better range than a fighter) to patrolling large areas. This sounds ideal for the UBW Navy as it has a large area to cover with little in the way of funds. I think I also heard that Confed were scrapping many of their corvettes, I forget why. If this were true then it would make them even more ideal for the impoverished UB.
As far as I know a confed corvette has never appeared in any of the games and there are no pictures. I might be wrong of this of course, I expect someone may chime in with evidence to the contrary. If there are none in the games (nor any images) then we can open up a whole new discussion about what it SHOULD look like in UE2
If you decide to add any brand new ships to UE2 it might be worth adding some ex-confed corvettes. I know there are references to them in the literature (in the WCP Lit if nothing else). They are meant to be a cheap solution (quicker and cheaper than a capship but with better range than a fighter) to patrolling large areas. This sounds ideal for the UBW Navy as it has a large area to cover with little in the way of funds. I think I also heard that Confed were scrapping many of their corvettes, I forget why. If this were true then it would make them even more ideal for the impoverished UB.
As far as I know a confed corvette has never appeared in any of the games and there are no pictures. I might be wrong of this of course, I expect someone may chime in with evidence to the contrary. If there are none in the games (nor any images) then we can open up a whole new discussion about what it SHOULD look like in UE2