Tarsus...

Discussion in 'Wing Commander 3D' started by BradMick, Mar 23, 2004.

  1. BradMick

    BradMick Spaceman

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    Yep, name says it all, for that's what it is. My poly limit for this is 10,000....in fact, my poly limit for all the ships is 10,000. Gotta love high end graphics cards :)

    Anyway, shouldn't be to much longer before its done and I start on the Orion.

    Brad Mick

    [​IMG]

    forgot...she's sitting pretty at 4684 tris right now....
  2. HammerHead

    HammerHead Rear Admiral

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    Looking darn GREAT!
    :cool:
  3. Aron Figaro

    Aron Figaro Spaceman

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    Very nice Tarsus, though the poly count's a little high...
  4. BradMick

    BradMick Spaceman

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    See, that's the beauty of it. The poly count ISN'T to high. Modern graphics cards will chew this thing up and spit it back out like it's nothin. Last I checked combat flight sim/flight sim (in general) has planes of 10,000 polys or less. Most stick around 3500, to 4500 polys. I figure that since i'm doing Privateer stuff, or Wing Commander stuff in general, it needs to be done right and as beautiful as possible for modern graphics stuff.

    BradMick
  5. Corsair(pilot)

    Corsair(pilot) Spaceman

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    Nice job, and good polygon efficiency! I always liked the Privateer ships... mostly the galaxy.
  6. Maj.Striker

    Maj.Striker Swabbie
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    Very nice. However, 10,000 seems excessive for the amount of detail that's there. My Tiger Claw model, for example, is only about 5500 polys...not that it's a great model or anything but 10,000 for a tarsus is ok if it has great deal of detail, this one apparently does not (or maybe I'm missing it), seems like you could reduce the poly count significantly without losing anything...Just my humble opinion.
  7. BradMick

    BradMick Spaceman

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    note that i stated what the poly count stood at :)

    [​IMG]

    anyway...here's the new updated one....it shows her triangulated as she is still unfinished. she'll be done tonight hopefully. who knows. CURRENT POLY COUNT IS 5076.

    BradMick
  8. BradMick

    BradMick Spaceman

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    Didnt mean to ignore you corsair,

    thanks for the comments. I'm trying to be as efficient as possible because i want as much detail as possible. the thing that sucks about the old wing commander ships, with sprites, you can do however detailed models you want, because all you're creating is a damn image. this gets a bit trickier. thank god for modern 3d graphics :)

    By the way, your work is amazing too dude. Look forward to seeing your completed work :)

    BradMick
  9. Eder

    Eder Mr. Standoff Staff Member

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    Good job, that looks real good. The polycount sounds about right too, I mean, it's a very simple design, but you still need a lot of triangles for all those damned cylinder engine things. Personally, I'd rather add some more details to the corners of the boxy part, though. They look kinda "sharp" for a high-detail model, specially considering the smoothness of the rounded parts.
  10. BradMick

    BradMick Spaceman

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    it's a game model. i was considering beveling the edges..but..it would raise the count a bit TO high. If I were doing her high res, she'd be peaking around 70,000 easy, as i'd be modeling hull plates, etc..etc..

    Brad Mick
  11. Delance

    Delance Victory, you say?

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    The Tarsus never looked so good.
  12. Dundradal

    Dundradal Frog Blast the Vent Core! Staff Member

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    except when we finally got enough money to get rid of it and buy a nice centurion...
  13. BradMick

    BradMick Spaceman

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    nearly done now...

    [​IMG]

    7618 POLYS. Needs cleaning, a lot of cleaning.


    BradMick
  14. Moonsword

    Moonsword Spaceman

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    It looks great.
  15. scheherazade

    scheherazade Rear Admiral

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    make a couple versions, go like

    25K
    10K
    5K
    1K
    250

    5 LOD's, and then it'll be game-suitable.
    so long as the game has LOD's that is.

    which vegastrike does btw. and it handles 50K models EZ without framerate drops.

    a proper high detail hull plated tarsus would rock out.

    -scheherazade
  16. Cam

    Cam Spaceman

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    The polycount should really depend on the use of the model--if you plan on rendering close-up shots for a high quality animation, you can go much higher than 10,000 polys. That being said, you can still put in a lot of details not seen on the original Tarsus to give it your own personal touch. How about a custom paint job, coupled with some rust to make it look like a well used privateer's ship? Combined with your modelling, it can provide a really realistic model.

    Good work on the Tarsus! I hope you do a Centurion. :D
  17. BradMick

    BradMick Spaceman

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    Only problem is, you couldn't have many ships on screen in a game enviroment. I'd love to do up like a 100k+ model, that'd be sweetness, but...alas, you could only have like..one of those in the game. :( Even if you used LOD's. Unfortunately i've had to put on hold my WC modeling project because I really REALLY need to focus on my Demo Reel so I can get a job.

    Brad Mick
  18. Unregistered

    Unregistered Guest

    the 50K centurions ran 100+ fps with a flight(4) of them on screen.

    i'm sure if they were 25K, with lesser LOD's for greater distances, it would run even better.

    plus remember, games like quake have well over 250K faces in the visible environment at any time, and they can post FPS's over 500 on good machines.

    so a space-sim with a couple 50K models isn't actaully that stressful on a decent machine.

    -scheherazade
  19. Tolwyn

    Tolwyn Vice Admiral Staff Member

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    yeah, but apply enviromental mapping, specular mapping, glow mapping and such plus high res backgrounds and you will experience a fps drop. I am speaking from my own experience.

    Example:

    Wing Commander Saga started with a 200 MHz CPU and TNT graphic card, now it requires a fast Geforce 3 to play without FPS drops (and even then you may experience problems). A Radeon 9500 + should handle the game without problems, BUT: there are no high poly ships in the game, highest poly count is around 3000 polies.
  20. scheherazade

    scheherazade Rear Admiral

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    you should treat your geometry and texture pipelines separately.

    it is true that high rez textures and background will slow things down.
    but lowering your polycount _won't_ speed it up.
    you have to go to the source of the problem.

    for example, you can take what you have now, and replace your ships with boxes (but using the same textues), and your fps will only go up a little bit.

    this is of course to some limit, I.E. 20 ships at once and you'll start to see some drop with your 3K models (but it'll be a linear degradation, not an instant crash in fps like when you exceed texture memory and start using AGP mem)

    saturate your textures, using simple boxes.
    see what texture resolutions you can use before FPS really drops.

    then make super high poly spheres, with crap 4x4 textures, and see how high you can get your polys before fps gets too slow.

    then back both off a bit and you have a good setup.


    i can say without a doubt, that you can go higher than you are (seeing from the fs2 models in shots).
    you may upset people with aged systems, but anyone with recent stuff (that wasn't some off the shelf dell that comes with integrated crap of course) will not even see a change in performance, but will see the change in looks.

    we've used 3-7K models in mfq3 since 2 years ago. and have some that are 15K now.
    plus the environment has its own couple 100 K to add to that (its quake so..).
    and everything uses textures well over 512 (1024x1024 is typical for a single texture and that would cover a single wing surface or something...)

    i get (1500mhz w/ 9700pro) around 90 fps constant at 1600x1200x32.

    so without a doubt you can go higher

    maybe FS2 engine has some overhead in itself that doesn't scale as well as quake, so you might not be able to be as frivalous with textures and geometry. but nevertheless, you should still be able to handle (in fs2) 5-7K with 2 or 3 1024x1024 maps, in an up to date system (not the latest, but a 'good' setup).

    i guess the real problem is in the hardware disparity.
    you can have:
    a fresh 9800XT with 256 megs
    a 9700 with 128
    a gf4 with 128
    a gf3 with 64
    a gf2 with 32
    a 7500/8500

    ALL of these you can call new, or at least recent. but the performance between the top of the list and the bottom is jaw dropping.

    what i say wouldn't be right for the bottom of the list at all. (well, things still scale the same way, but the max tolerance is much less).

    if you're aimed at the bottom of the list as your typical user, then you're dead on, don't change a thing.

    but if you're to the middle or top, then you can afford a lot more polys than 3K/model.


    -scheherazade

    P.S. tolwyn
    i'm not telling you what to do, in case my rant sounds like that.
    i love the progress you guys have made. its totally amazing.
    i love your stuff :)

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