Space Sim MMO wishlist

K

Kalfor

Spaceman
So, imagine a company was working on a Space Sim Massive Multi-player. A game someone who dreamed of Privateer Online would be co-responsible for.

What would YOU like to see and experience in this game. Anything goes: details, specific gameplay, plot, pve, pvp, etc

Thanks for the input.
 
Eve online looks pretty good. Downloaded the demo...then never played it and m trail persiod ran out.

I liked Freelancer. Tons of different factions to piss off and they did a pretty cool job keeping the newbies and the vets seperate so that a lev 20 pilot couldn't go and wipe out guys just starting out. The online was pretty fun but your monetary gain was limited to a single server. So if you had 30 hours of fly time on one server and reached a high lev and jumped to another server...you ended up starting over again. That happened to me a few times when servers went down or I just coudn't find the same server again...starting from scratch over an over blew. A central server with stats linked to the cd key would be nice. Then again most of the servers had different start rules where you start with different levels of money and such.
Multiplayer is nice but most times people jump nline without a clue as to how to play, get their asses kiked and ditch the game. Or it sits there for years and by the time they get into it it's no longer popular and they end up bitching about how there are no people online anymore. :p
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Oh they are facinated by us Casey. Our ability to kill without remourse. The way we eat with chopsticks.
 
(I know why he's asking, he's asking because he wants you to play Taikodom! And you should! Because it's fun, much more polished then the last Beta, and much more English friendly!)

I'd like to touch on some things that Deadman said...

1) The Learning Curve - he mentioned that sometimes in multiplayer new players jump in and get killed alot, and so they give up. Look at Allegiance. They had almost no new members joining the community because after an hour of gameplay newbs were so frustrated they gave up. Some of that is the community - in every MMO in existance there is 1 or 2 hundred "leet" players who make their name mowing down ranks of newbs without mercy (or respect). I think it's important of any simulation game that it be very intuitive. WCP and WCSO are good examples of this - the controls, flight model, and combat were so simple that I had no problems jumping into and understanding how to play the game from the first moment even without a tutorial. By comparison, X-Wing or TIE Fighter had so many fancy switches and buttons I quickly mastered the element of gameplay enough to enjoy myself, but not enough to win. The game should be intuitive enough that players used to playing simulators can pick it up with tutorials (This is an area I think Taikodom is weak in - it's very hard to learn to play without sitting through at least an hour of tutorials).

2) The Multiplayer - every MMO in existance lauds their PVP enviornments. Enough, I say. PVP is one thing, but there should be enough things to do that non-PVP players can enjoy the game without needing to get into a guild, master the current PVP skill sets, or build a quality team out of the rabble that usually populates online games. (This is also an area I think Taikodom is weak in - there tend to be one or two guilds that lead the top of the scoreboard and everyone else is pretty much at their mercy, competing for mining rights, transit rights, and everything else under the sun. You either join a competitive guild or you're just SOL.)

3) Keeping Busy - there should ALWAYS be something to do. I can't stress the ALWAYS part. And it should not involve waiting for PVP matches to start, asteroids that you can mine to respawn, or a battle group to arrive. At any time while I am logged in I should be able to launch and fly to point X and find something to shoot mine or interact with - WITHOUT a quest. Yes, quests are great. But they usually lead you in a linear path from one to the next. What about free form exploring? A good example: Most MMO's take place during a war. I would want to be able to find the battlezone currently being fought in and jump right into the fight without accepting a quest. In Guild WArs, for example, I can often wander into an Instanced area and find something to fight that's challenging and fun while I am exploring the map - not for a quest or mission, but just for fun. (This is an area I think Taikodom has some potential in. It's doing well, but needs to go farther. For example, during the last Beta I played under there were random pirate fleets that would spawn and engage in combat with people. Which brings me to my next point...)

4) Random Encounters - this is always important for any game, but it's doubly so for an MMO. You need to know that flying from Point A to Point B is not always safe. Freelancer did this very well - at any intersection there was a hub of traffic moving around the galaxy, police who would scan your cargo, pirates who would attack you (and other NPC's) Bounty Hunters who might kill you if you did enough bad deeds. The game needs to stay interesting and exciting for people to come back, and what better way then randomness? If you never know that the next jump might land you in a protected fleet or in the middle of a pirate nest, you're ALWAYs going to want to make that next jump just to see.

More thoughts later, maybe. A bit burned out today.
 
1: I would like to have ground combat, and an entirely 3d and interactive planet/space port.

2: Fly in the atmosphere.

3: Design my own spaceship, and fly it.

4: NPC fleets which are under my command.


ya


I haven't played Taikodom since I've reformatted my hard rive. I was thinking of downloading it again.
 
1. It needs to be a Wing Commander game. I'm sure Jumpgate: Evolution, Eve Online and Freespace: The Potato Chronicles are all excellent games... but I just don't care. I want to live in a familiar universe rather than one created solely for the purpose of taking my $15 a month. I'm sorry, I know this rules out a number of excellent games... but it's just how it is for me.

I think the same goes for "regular" MMP games: I never understood why Everquest was so popular, since Everquest wasn't a 'real' thing - Ultima Online was set in the fantasy world I'd dreamed about exploring further for years already (on the other side of the same coin, I never understood the draw of World of Warcraft... because no matter how simple and fun the game might be, the existing Warcraft fiction was just so stupid).

I think we're about to see the first great generation of adapted MMORPGs (since UO, anyway) -- things like Age of Conan and Warhammer Online seem to be taking settings that are valuable for what already exists and giving them the love they deserve.

(Note to someone important looking for loaded MMPRPG settings, make Robin Hood Online. I want to play that. Or Dinosaurs Online. That would be so rad.)

2. Define personal identity correctly. This was the singular problem that ran through the early 'space' games - the ones that dried up the market. Here's the deal: there's a balance to be struck and you can't just tip everything in one direction. That is to say that you both are and are not your car.

Earth and Beyond and Star Wars Galaxies screwed this up in opposite directions. The former dropped characters entirely, while the latter left out spaceships (at launch). Those were both crippling flaws. Our theoretical MMP space game needs to have a traditional setting for character interaction - on bases, planets, etc. - over which a space combat engine is placed. Now, the degree to which this is developed can vary entirely... it could be anything from customized avatars in an environment that lets them communicate and choose their missions/ships/cargo/etc... or it could be half the game, with personal combat and weapons and so forth. I prefer the first of these, because...

3. Simple doesn't suck. Every fan-created 'Privateer' wishlist in the 1990s was full of silly pie-in-the-sky suggestions. I want to own a base! I want to run an entire fleet! Giant things that add little fun in exchange for vastly changing the game dynamic. Don't let this happen. Remember how you felt when you first saw Star Wars? Was your reaction that you really wanted to be Han Solo... or that you really wanted to be Han Solo's limited liability corporate sponsor? Owning a giant fleet of ships and running an entire star system and blargh blargh blargh is neat until you actually think about how it would work.

4. Think really, really, really hard about ship customization. I'll be honest: I don't like what they came up with for Privateer Online (2). The moduler ships - in description, anyway - were a lame concept. They destroy the *style* of the thing, which is a lot more important than people understand. Pick your cockpit/wing/engine/fuselage/etc. sounds like a fun idea that lets you have 10,000,000 possible ships in your world... but in reality it'll just look like a mess.

Again, here, do as Privateer - lets have specific ships that can be (now visibly) upgraded with better engines/generators/turrets/etc. This keeps the art styled, it allows players to identify ships in a reasonable fashion and it enables a competition among pilot preferences. Let players cutomize colors, nose art and even what's in the cockpit.

5. Start small. Bigger isn't always better - give me one sector of space that's really well done instead of some massive setting that encompasses everything but done only moderately well. Give me twenty fantastic bases to explore instead of a thousand carbon copies of two standards. Do this well and I'll happily by new content to keep building out the universe.

6. Make space interesting. This applies to all future space games: one of the problems with space sims is that just plain space is *dull*. It's like an airplane game without the danger of hitting the ground or a worry about physics that might trip you up during a battle.

Our design team needs to sit down and plan to implement a huge list of 'stuff' to populate space: black holes that suck you towards them, nebulas that block your systems, asteroid fields, minefields, debris fields, ion storms that can zap your fighter, pulsars that force you to fly through their shadow, wrecks of ancient ships to explore, planetary atmosphers, fry holes full of monsters, etc., etc. You also need stuff to do - savlage, mine, ship goods, dogfight, hunt, etc. That all has to be worked out in a manner that I don't feel has been yet. In short, the lions share of our game should be played in space mode - so it has to be *cool*.

7. Reasonable death mechanics. This remains my number one worry and I haven't solved it even in my head yet after all these years. The game needs some kind of gloss to explain why after Deathkiller33 blows up my Centurion X that I'm transported back to a base and not heavily penalized. I think this requires a lot more thought than they give it for the Priv Online 2 concept, with clones and government stipends... it should be a basic element of the game design. Are fighters and upgrades so cheap that losing them doesn't suck? Do you not lose them at all? If so, why? Do you automatically eject? Is there a space sorcerer who brings you back to life? This needs thought.
 
Its not exactly an MMO, but in the old BBSdoors game 'Trade Wars 2002', when your ship was destroyed, you were in an escape pod and could go back to a safe port and buy a new ship (you never got the destroyed one back) and while you were in the escape pod, if you got destroyed again, then you could start a new character the next day.

I agree with LOAF's list totally. MMOs thus far have been poorly presented.
 
I completely agree that one of the central concepts to follow needs to be a graduated process where additional 'areas' of space are developed over time. Start with environments that are small but well detailed, and give players a reason to continue to invest in the storyline and planned upgrades.

Bigger is definitely not always better here - at least initially. The aim of a project like this should be to do a few things really, really well. Expansions can always follow.

As an aside, I think that the classic WC format would benefit and update nicely with a little thought put into the interaction vehicle between missions. It would be great, for example, to walk around a carrier or station and interact with others - a neat way to continue expanding a great formula.
 
Hey Jason_Ryock
Yes and No. Im AM asking because Im directly envolved on the development of Taikodom. But its not simply because I want you and the others to play, but because I want to be proud of what I helped create. After all, Im the space sims junky of the company ;)

I couldnt see a better way of finding out what people would like to see then dropping by here again and simply asking. Good to know some of your ideas are not unlike ours

Id like to "hear" a little more. LOAFs comment about size is very well noted. Its common for people without practical experience on game development to thing big. Too big, sometimes. We know better, thats what I can say ;)

Now, what else? What would you want to be? What would you like to do? ELTEE mentioned the WC format missions with "something in between". LOAF mentioned Freelancer/Privateer.

Id also wanted to see more people giving shots at it. Cmon! Wouldnt you love to have a chance to be part of it?
 
I would like to command a mercenary squad and own a troop transport, and hire my group out to various factions/companies to board and take over ships, stations and ground bases.

Ok seriously.

I would like to be a mercenary though, and hire my ship out.

I personally think a good mercenary system has not exactly been done yet with any mmo game. In this I would like to have a faction relationship system where you do contracts which can be a variety of things and can last maybe a day or two, or until its completed. And the outcome effects your relations with that faction or factions involved. Have some heavy duty contracts which can bring a faction relation from the heavy duty negatives to neutral.

Being able to ditch a contract because of a better offer, and stuff like that.
 
I just want to make a quick buck selling stuff and ripping people off, and feed some energy blasts to dissatisfied customers...

And a storyline to complete, even if the game has no ending :)
 
To be able to put bounties on people he doesn't like.

That would be cool. Think about it. Yeah sure in most every game you can go out and kill people for bounties. But you can't put a price on someones head. I'm lev 2 and Frank has been cutting into my robot sex slave trade but he's lev 14 and I'm no match for him. Fortunatly I'm been saving up and have 50,000 credits to put up.

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If it walks like a duck. Quacks lie a duck and looks like a duck. It has to be a meal.
 
Deadman_ny said:
To be able to put bounties on people he doesn't like.
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You missed the joke.

Deadman_ny said:
If it walks like a duck. Quacks lie a duck and looks like a duck. It has to be a meal.
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Maybe instead of typing these out each time, you could use the time to proofread over your main post.

AD said:
Hehe, that could add an extremely interesting dynamic to the game...
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I'm surprised other games don't have that (do other games have that?).
 
Trade wars used to let you do that.. but its an old text game.

I really wish that more MMO's made death a bigger penalty. I mean.. sure its kind of annoying to have to go collect your corpse.. but that is all it is, annoying.

There needs to be a personal cost like a lost ship or finances to make it really sting.
 
ChrisReid said:
I'm surprised other games don't have that (do other games have that?).
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I don't play many online games so I have no idea really. It would surprise me if this doesn't already happen to some degree already in games like World of Warcraft, even if unsanctioned. But I'm not sure theres an official bounty system in any of the existing MMOs. Mostly you end up hunting NPCs for bounty in missions or side quests. It only seems like a natural extension of that system.
 
NinjaLA said:
Trade wars used to let you do that.. but its an old text game.

I really wish that more MMO's made death a bigger penalty. I mean.. sure its kind of annoying to have to go collect your corpse.. but that is all it is, annoying.

There needs to be a personal cost like a lost ship or finances to make it really sting.
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A good ballance is needed though, because harsher penalties are annoying when you have to put up with griefers and other people making trouble. IF there's going to be stiffer penalities there has to be more protection against people being jerks...

An escape pod system would probably work ok as it leaves a reasonable explanation as to why you still have your credits. A "garage" system would work too where you set up a berth in a space dock. You can store parts you don't want to equip on your ship.... or loot etc etc... So you only lose whatever you actually have on your ship at that given time . IT could even be based on your financial abilities. You get set up with one at the start and pay a minimum credit rate per month or something but also get minimal storage). You could move it to whatever space docks you've discovered that are friendly but for a fee. THe bigger the storage space the bigger credit fee.
 
AD said:
An escape pod system would probably work ok as it leaves a reasonable explanation as to why you still have your credits. A "garage" system would work too where you set up a berth in a space dock. You can store parts you don't want to equip on your ship.... or loot etc etc... So you only lose whatever you actually have on your ship at that given time . IT could even be based on your financial abilities. You get set up with one at the start and pay a minimum credit rate per month or something but also get minimal storage). You could move it to whatever space docks you've discovered that are friendly but for a fee. THe bigger the storage space the bigger credit fee.
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The persistent world part of Steel Battalion handled this all pretty well. When you get hit really bad, your eject light flickers. There's no auto eject, you have to decide when to manually punch it. If you do eject, you lose your expensive vehicle. If you don't eject, you completely die and have to completely start over from scratch. That happened to me one time and it was very painful, but it made every mission all the more exciting.

With the money you have, you build up a stable of fighters. The cheapest ones can be repurchased with the money you'd make off one mission, but they're no fun. The most expensive ones could take months to earn up the cash, but they're so good that they form the backbone of any squadron. Weaker players line up to defend them, and they're not at serious risk unless the opposing team has equivalent hardware - and in that case they'd still likely have an opportunity to retreat (honorable opponents might even let someone with something like that retreat). Man, that was a great game.
 
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