Nothing special

[Mad Hatter]

Yeah!!
I just got my 3 WC books I ordered from Amazon: Action Stations, Freedom Flight and Pilgrim Stars. Along with the WCM novelization, that makes 4 WC books that I now own.
Anyway, don`t expect to hear from me for a while, I`ll be catching up on my reading.

 

[Shane]

Never really liked Freedom Flight. Perhaps I'm too much of a nitpicker. Saw the movie, didn't like it, so I have no desire to read the books involved with it. I've heard the contortions folks have gone through trying to reconcile everything. I choose to bury my head in the sand and pretened the movie never happened. Action Stations was pretty good. I really liked End Run, Fleet Action and False Colors.

 

[Twister]

why didn't you like Freedom Flight?

 

[Quarto]

Hmm, well I personally think that Freedom Flight is far superior to anything Forstchen ever wrote. For one thing, the characters were much truer to WC - thanks to Ellen Guon. And the book itself was much better, simply because Mercedes Lackey is way better as a writer than Forstchen could ever be.

But that, of course, is just my opinion

.

 

[Dralthi5]

Okay, Bill Forstchen isn't the best writer ever (whoever edits his books needs to be taken out back and shot), but he can spin out a good adventure. Ever read the Lost Regiment series or 1945? Superb action scenes and great stories, period.

Hey, Shane, why didn't you like the movie? When I first saw it the second day it came out, I was a tad disappointed, but now I realize how cool it is. Watch it a few times, man, it'll grow on you.

Freedom Flight isn't my favorite WC novel (it's something like fourth or fifth on my list), it seems to take things too lightly, without the "drama" in Forstchen's books. It's still good, though, because it's the only game-related novel where the action still takes place on the Tiger's Claw.



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If I'm locked on, there's no such thing as evasive action!

 

[Shane]

Mad Hatter, you may or may not want to read the rest of it, since it may give plot aspects of Freedom Flight away. As I said, some of my complaints are nitpicky (and it has been a while since I've read the book, so I can't recall all of them. One thing I do recall is the color of the laser fire was inconsistent between the game and the book. It seemed also that it took just a round or two of fire to blow Kilrathi craft out of space. The last part of the book made me think of the escape from the Death Star in Star Wars.

There were some good things about it. I liked the opening and, as I've mneioned elsewhere, I wish that Roberts or whomever made the decision, hadn't given Hobbes that personality overlay. I liked the approach the book took in better explaining his defection. That got ruined with WCIII, even though it can be consistent with that. I liked seeing the Claw and some of the day to day Ops and was interested to see that it was Hunter that got Angel her move into command. The exceptionally acurate descriptions of Australlia were pretty good as well

I just had trouble with the timeline. It seemed like a lot happened in a short period of time. Paladin gets back from the Claw (wasn't he still around the ship in SM2 even though he wasn't flying, or am I mistaken about that. Anyhow, he gets back, gets this new gig, new ship, etc in a very short period of time. Granted he was friends with Tolwyn, but still.

As for the movie...

If it would have not had the WC name on it, I probably would have liked it better. The cats looked bad, the death of Bossman never made much sense. Yes I heard that it was a mistake and he was later found. Why go to all that bother. Why not kill off a different pilot? I can understand the reasons for not wanting to just redo WC1 on the big screen, especially since it might make things more confusing for those who hadn't actually played the games. Then there was the whole Pilgrim concept, which no one ever heard of before. I read a while back the WC history that LOAF or someone had put together. It was nicely done, but I felt that the sections involving the Pilgrim War and how it was reconciled with the rest of the time line almost gave me a head ache. A bunch of people either take or get demoted, other folks (like Bossman) are found out not to be dead, etc. I think I'd almost be happier if at the end of the Movie, it fades out and then all of a sudden Mark Hammill sits up in bed, Ginger Lynn Allen comes into the room asks him what wrong and he tells her he had the strangest dream...

 

[Dralthi5]

To enjoy the movie, you can't analyze it like that. You just have to sit back and have fun...

And the whole Ghorah Khar-Hobbes thing wasn't ruined by WC3. The personality overlaid onto Ralgha nar Hhallas sympathized with the rebels, even though the real Ralgha didn't. We (and Hobbes) just didn't know that at the time.

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If I'm locked on, there's no such thing as evasive action!

[This message has been edited by Dralthi5 (edited June 08, 2000).]

 

[Shane]

I agree it can be consistent, the overlay took place ahead of time. However, before WC3 I had my own view of "The Way Things Would Be." Part of that view revolved around the Emperor and Thrakath being mistaken about the how key the rebelling systems would be, and that you would see two Kilrathi factions appear, the Imperialists (supported by the Emperor's clan and the military structure in general) and the Reformers (supported by the majority of the priestesses, Kilrathi who have been living close to humanity and who grow weary of the strict caste system, etc.) I had a scenario where Hobbes and the priestess from Freedom flight had actually mated years before, but she hid the pregnancy from him. Thrakath though had discovered it and the location of his son and forced Hobbes to face his son in combat. But, I should get over it, it's been what 6 years, now. I was, though, really annoyed with the game about the defection, because it seemed very contrived. At least the novel fleshed it out a little better.

As for the movie I may go out and rent it and give it another shot. Probably the wife and I will riff it MST3K style, though.

 

[Dralthi5]

As for the movie I may go out and rent it and give it another shot. Probably the wife and I will riff it MST3K style, though.

Traitor!

But, I guess the movie's not for everyone.



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If I'm locked on, there's no such thing as evasive action!

 

[Mad Hatter]

I`ve never seen the movie, and every time I decide to finally go out and get it, someone persuades me it`s too crapy to watch. Is it that bad? I did enjoy the novel though.

 

[Dralthi5]

Mad Hatter: No, it's not that bad. It's better than The Phantom Menace, at any rate, as well a lot of futuristic, military sci-fi action flicks (ie. Starship Troopers and the like). If you're a true Wing Commander fan, check out the movie and be your own judge.

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If I'm locked on, there's no such thing as evasive action!

[This message has been edited by Dralthi5 (edited June 08, 2000).]

 

[Metras]

Mercedes Lackey's books that she writes (like The Chrome Borne) are great novels to read. I agree on Quarto on how Foreschen isn't that great a writer.

...Now if only the pilots in WC had Mage-Sight...

 

[Mad Hatter]

Being better than "The Phantom Menace" doesn`t say much.

I`ll give it a try though, and if I start hating WC, you`ll be the one I`ll be hunting down.

 

[Quarto]

About the overlay - maybe the Hobbes we knew was actually the "real" Hobbes? Maybe that trigger in WC3 activated an alternate personality, which they had installed while they were interrogating him on Ghorah Khar?
Personally, I also didn't like the personality overlay thing, but I've come to accept it. Just as long as nobody calls Hobbes a traitor

.

Mad Hatter: The Movie really ain't bad. I liked it - just don't expect it to fit in with the rest of the Universe, that's all.

Shane: The only one who says Bossman's death was a mistake is Earthworm

. He's dead, and nobody is planning on bringing him back.

And as for Freedom Flight... the Bonnie Heather was probably arranged quite some time earlier.
I sure hope you're being sarcastic about the "exceptionally accurate description of Australia". Otherwise, I'm gonna have to laugh at you, because I live right next to Brisbane, and it's nothing at all like what Hunter describes.

Dralthi5: Forstchen's books may have the drama, but they don't have the grammar

. I mean, this guy is supposed to be a professional, right?

And I dislike the way he pushes those historical analogies to the extremes.

 

[Dralthi5]

Mad Hatter: Come after me, and I'll... well, I'm not sure what I'll do. But you won't be a happy camper!

Quarto: Too true that mistakes run rampant through Forstchen's books, but I like the historical analogies (I'll probably major in American history once I get out of this hellhole called high school in a couple of years). 'Sides, I think Forstchen's more of a professor than a writer, but that doesn't mean his books aren't any less fun to read. For me, at least.

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If I'm locked on, there's no such thing as evasive action!

 

[Shane]

You're right Quatro, I was kidding about Australia. It has been slow around here so I've been reading old posts to get a feel for the place and saw one written by you talking about Freedom Flight and Brisbane and how it isn't hot there at the moment. Figured I'd get a response out of you.

While I wasn't thrilled with Phantom Menace, in my book it was better than WC. I doubt I have time before I leave for vacation (2 weeks in Hawaii) at some point I'll rent them both and watch them back to back. I think part of the problem I had with Wing Commander was Matthew Lilard (sp?) Never thought he was that good and thought he was upstaged in the movie by his hair.

Yes, I've come to accept tht Hobbes had the overlay. The idea of which personality is real is quite intriguing. One could argue he was caught, had the overlay done and released, remebering only the challenge and that he got away. Hmm, I like that.

 

[Shane]

I`ve never seen the movie, and every time I decide to finally go out and get it, someone persuades me it`s too crapy to watch. Is it that bad? I did enjoy the novel though.

Don't let my opinions (or others for that matter) keep you from doing something you might enjoy. A lot of critics and people have ripped some of my favortie movies (like Blues Brothers 2000, for example), but I still saw it and I'm glad I did. Clearly there are people here who liked the movie, so it can't be that awful. I think it is, but who am I? I'll step down from my soapbox now.

 

[Earthworm]

Shane: The only one who says Bossman's death was a mistake is Earthworm

. He's dead, and nobody is planning on bringing him back.

I would appreciate if you didn't put words in my mouth Q.

I never said such a thing.

Dralthi5: Forstchen's books may have the drama, but they don't have the grammar

. I mean, this guy is supposed to be a professional, right?

Every writer makes mistakes, even the mighty Quarto.

Besides, what's a few grammar mistakes when you get a lot more action.

And I dislike the way he pushes those historical analogies to the extremes.

I love those. It's only because of those books that I was able to pass my history class.

 

[Earthworm]

While I wasn't thrilled with Phantom Menace, in my book it was better than WC. I doubt I have time before I leave for vacation (2 weeks in Hawaii) at some point I'll rent them both and watch them back to back.

The only thing I liked about Phantom Menace were the visuals. The whole thing was Lucas trying to cash in on the success of the first three movies.

I think part of the problem I had with Wing Commander was Matthew Lilard (sp?) Never thought he was that good and thought he was upstaged in the movie by his hair.

The only actor that bothered me was Blair the rest of the cast was either good (Angel, Maniac, Tolwyn, Sansky) or excelent (Paladin, Gerald, Obutu-even though he has only a small part).


[This message has been edited by Earthworm (edited June 09, 2000).]

 

[Dralthi5]

** Besides, what's a few grammar mistakes when you get a lot more action.**

Ah, my thoughts exactly.

** It's only because of those books that I was able to pass my history class.**

You're probably kidding, but I've put some of those allusions to good use in history classes.

** The only thing I liked about the Phantom Menace were the visuals.**

Ditto. And the final battle between Qui-Gon, Obi-Wan, and Darth Maul was pretty cool.

** The only actor that bothered me was Blair the rest of the cast was either good (Angel, Maniac, Tolwyn, Sansky) or excelent(Paladin, Gerald, Obutu-even though he has only a small part).**

David Suchet was good as Sansky. Would've liked to seen that whole traitor subplot thing, though. Hey, anybody ever seen Suchet as Hercules Poirot? And David Warner and Jurgen Prochnow are always cool.


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If I'm locked on, there's no such thing as evasive action!

[This message has been edited by Dralthi5 (edited June 09, 2000).]