WC:CD "Border Worlds"

JasonRocZ

Vice Admiral
I haven't really touched any Border World fighters.... And they will be inclusive in the mod. I mean there on the frontier there's bound to be some action there right?

So anyways here's a fighter based on some parts from other fighters thrown together to make some type of mainstay fighter....I haven't figured out what to call it yet and I'm not even done with the textures yet...but it's gettin there...Once I think of the fighters name and it's statistics I'll come up with some type of "Pliers" type of description :)
 

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Hi Delance....I didn't get the impression that the Border Worlds was just a militia..I could be wrong tho could anyone clarify?... I tried to access the WC4 Script but it says that the users account is expired or something... But I could be wrong....I was trying to do some type of design that's a little different.....But I'll keep workin on it... any feedback is good feedback.....I was thinking that this fighter was going to be some sort of Missile heavy ship similar to the "Wasp" how it has those swarmer packs. I'll resize those launcher tubes and see how it looks. It a mix of the Banshee fighter (Fuselage/Cockpit), Excalibur (Engines), And the launchers I kinda looked at some WCOnline design docs and looks at a few ideas there
 
Updated somewhat What do you think?
 

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Hi Delance....I didn't get the impression that the Border Worlds was just a militia..I could be wrong tho could anyone clarify?

Border Worlds Militia

Pliers completely scraps two perfectly functional Hellcats just to keep things flying. The Intrepid runs the entire two-week war damaged and unescorted (and is given back to Confed). All of their toys are either stolen or garage projects that break after the first use (and the stolen stuff is, again, given back to Confed). Their best officers are recent defections (who go back to Confed... probably because the BWM pays minimum wage). I also recall something about their bomber being a shuttle conversion.

Doesn't sound like they have the budget for a Banshee armed with six capship plasma guns to me.

EDIT: Unless they were really faux plasma cannons made of cardboard to trick the bugs into attacking them instead of the bombers.
 
Alright well I guess they are a militia...But wouldn't you think the militia would get beefed up a little bit? And I'm not sure if those are going to be some type of plasma guns or something similar maybe Mass Driver or launchers of some sort....I'm thinking post Secret Ops not during the WC4 Conflict, please keep that thought in the mind :) So anything could happen ya know. Also check out this link of online material that was a project that never was... It seems to show some type of shapes that we're viewing here. https://cdn.wcnews.com/newestshots/full/wco05.jpg
 
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The game didn't do a great job of depicting the border worlds situation, but the WCIV novel tells you just how desperate they are.. The book describes blair seeing ancient fighters which look like museum pieces, little more than engines with a cockpit strapped to them.. They are supposed to be in bad shape.

And honestly I don't think any militia ever gets beefed up a bit.. usually they have to scrape for any equipment at all.. take Privateer for example.. the militia flies the same ships as the pirates do. And in a fighter with the dubious distinction of costing more of its pilot's lives than any other in the war. Militias are supposed to be poorly equipped.. otherwise its an army. not a militia
 
Hmm Interesting....

So you guys don't think that salvaged parts from an Excalibur or using old Banshee parts is a good idea.. Maybe that I should just scrap the whole Border World idea so that the WCCD mod doesn't have any Border World Fighters? or just redesign it so that it looks like perhaps something from the WC Movie? I mean come to think of it doesn't it seem logical to have some type of Border World involvement? Physically? or should I just give mention to them in the mod...Let me know what you think
 
That's kinda my point Nomad...After Reading Star Soldier again... I can't really find anything that says the Border Worlds are in such a bad shape...I think at the Time of WC4 they had just broken away from the Confederation. Maybe that's why they were so financially bad. Or it's possible that they still are the same but I don't think the Border Worlds are such a bad shape after a period of what 15 years right? Things were bound to get better at least one could only hope. But true we don't really know how good they were after WC4.
 
A nation can turn its fortunes around pretty quickly sometimes. The UK was the sick man of Europe (economically) when I was a kid, now it's one of the richest (GDP) - and I'm yet to turn thirty.

A little food for thought.
 
Remember a lot of time has passed from Black Lance incident and with the coming of nephilm. Besides in Phrophesy most of the BW top dogs are in confeds top position. And it would make sense form them to provide help to BW that went through Confed/BL conflict. So it wouldnt be that over the top for them to develop something to counter nephilms. Otherwise the ships from WC4 would allso do and old confed ships, they just need to upgrade weapons for some ships.

By the way i like the first one, looks like Banshe with heavy weapons and extra armor plating.

Oh yeah think on this, if pirates could get their hands on Excaliburs at BL incident then they might be more common in Arena time, what with the new line of confed ships replacing old ones.
 
Oh a suggestion for weapon load out for your 1st ship, twin linked triple particle cannons and quad stormfires beneath cockpit nose and some shark teeth nose paint. :D
 
That's kinda my point Nomad...After Reading Star Soldier again... I can't really find anything that says the Border Worlds are in such a bad shape...I think at the Time of WC4 they had just broken away from the Confederation. Maybe that's why they were so financially bad. Or it's possible that they still are the same but I don't think the Border Worlds are such a bad shape after a period of what 15 years right? Things were bound to get better at least one could only hope. But true we don't really know how good they were after WC4.

Lack of information neither confirms status of being a superpower nor does it confirm status of being bankrupt. The most reasonable method is to look at the older, larger "Border Worlders," the Landreich. They can't go toe-to-toe with Confed due to smaller size and still using surplus machinery. And that's a proper Navy. My memory is foggy on the conclusion of WC4, but is BWM now fully independent or did they return back under Confed's protection?

If they're independent I would say figure it like the Landreich - they have a professional Navy now, but it's a step behind Confed technology-wise. No superfighters, no superlasers, no supercarriers. This is actually where you can have some fun: ships that require lots of skill but can get the job done, rather than newfangled ships that fly themselves.

A nation can turn its fortunes around pretty quickly sometimes. The UK was the sick man of Europe (economically) when I was a kid, now it's one of the richest (GDP) - and I'm yet to turn thirty.

A little food for thought.

The UK isn't a third-world country with no real industrial base that was formerly a severely exploited colony. The UK is a former mega empire that exploited colonies and has a sophisticated industrial and high-technology that will keep it afloat in its "retirement from superpower status."

Better examples would be an actual former colony that fought for independence and has since become successful.

Remember a lot of time has passed from Black Lance incident and with the coming of nephilm. Besides in Phrophesy most of the BW top dogs are in confeds top position. And it would make sense form them to provide help to BW that went through Confed/BL conflict. So it wouldnt be that over the top for them to develop something to counter nephilms. Otherwise the ships from WC4 would allso do and old confed ships, they just need to upgrade weapons for some ships.

All those defections of Confed officers to the BWM happened because Tolwyn was trying to start the space holocaust. It has nothing to do with the BWM being saints - IIRC they were guilty of a few things, too, just none of them warranted being slaughtered wholesale for the sake of the latest eugenics programs. I don't think any favoritism would have extended to selling the BWM their secret super weapons. The Landreich was there first and the best they got was a modified escort carrier - and even then only because Confed was using them.

The best-case scenario would likely have been that the BWM was upgraded from buying "surplus heading to scrap" to "current models heading to surplus" and an officer exchange program.

Oh yeah think on this, if pirates could get their hands on Excaliburs at BL incident then they might be more common in Arena time, what with the new line of confed ships replacing old ones.

Those weren't pirates. Those were Black Lance pilots pretending to be pirates. Kind of like the Black Lance pilots in Dragons pretending to be Border Worlders. The only "real" pirates are probably the ones you fight after dueling Maniac. The rest are either being helped/run by the Black Lance or are actually the Black Lance themselves.

And this is all beside the point that the appeal of the BWM is they're underdog that has to beg, borrow, and steal just to beat the enemy. Making them Confed 2.0 removes their personality and quirks.
 
I'm sorry and forgive me all who oppose these thoughts but......

I really cannot believe that the Border Worlds would not have some type of different fighters post secret ops...... But I have decided that this fighter will be done for and not included in the mod due to so much people being adament not to include that perhaps that the Border Worlds actually improved over the period of time between the WC4 and the Nephilim conflict post Secret Ops...Also sorry to those that wanted to see something a little different for the Border Worlds. I guess it's just a subject that I'm not going to touch.
 
Those weren't pirates. Those were Black Lance pilots pretending to be pirates. Kind of like the Black Lance pilots in Dragons pretending to be Border Worlders. The only "real" pirates are probably the ones you fight after dueling Maniac. The rest are either being helped/run by the Black Lance or are actually the Black Lance themselves.

It seems to me that the "renegade faction" of Confed (as Blair put it, it may or may not mean the same as the "Black Lance") paid some random people as mercenaries and pirates, but those are just losers backed by the conspirators, but not part of the conspiracy. The pilot Blair captures (and later testifies) is one such example.

And this is all beside the point that the appeal of the BWM is they're underdog that has to beg, borrow, and steal just to beat the enemy. Making them Confed 2.0 removes their personality and quirks.

I agree. The Banshee is the most emblematic UBW ship because the clever way it uses the oldest, weakest and presumably cheapest gun around in a surprising effective and fun way. It was a very enjoyable surprise that the puny lasers (the weapon of Salthis and Hornets) could still wreck so much havoc.

One rationalization for Vindicators (tachyons don't sound cheap, light or not) is that they probably are few in number, especially taking in account that on the novel they are still using scimitars. If you had loads of high tech fancy fighters you wouldn’t be using those. (Of course that’s just a wild guess on my part).
 
I'm sorry and forgive me all who oppose these thoughts but......

I really cannot believe that the Border Worlds would not have some type of different fighters post secret ops...... But I have decided that this fighter will be done for and not included in the mod due to so much people being adament not to include that perhaps that the Border Worlds actually improved over the period of time between the WC4 and the Nephilim conflict post Secret Ops...Also sorry to those that wanted to see something a little different for the Border Worlds. I guess it's just a subject that I'm not going to touch.

I didn't mean to come across as being a BWM hater, or bashing your project. I was just a bit worried when I saw six mega cannons on a Banshee that we'd be seeing another BWM mega superfighter concept. I'd love to see BWM around and doing the dirty post-war work Confed wants nothing to do with, and doing it in the "paste and glue specials" we've come to appreciate. That doesn't mean we have to see the same old Banshee, Vindicator, or Avenger verbatim, but they should certainly feel... humble.
 
If you've watched all or most of his other model threads his final concept is usually much different from the starting concept because he takes people's advice into consideration when designing these fighters and ships.

JasonRocZ is just exploring the possibility that the Border Worlds have become somewhat more financially stable since the end of WC4. We see a major economic turnaround for Confed between WC4 and Prophecy, so why not one for the Border Worlds? There's nothing suggesting that the Border Worlds are still a piss poor nation that can barely keep its own ships pieced together, much less fight a war.

But maybe we can say, "Hey, I like the design, but how about fewer weapons?" JasonRocZ has been more than willing to be reasonable based on how the community feels a Wing Commander mod should present itself, and this ship would be no different.
 
Here's something a little bit different.....Tell me what you think...Should I totally get rid of the tubes for launchers or what?
 

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This design feel much more orihinal than the former, which is good. It also have the feeling of a bunch of parts sticked together, which is also good for a BW ship. It almost look like a shuttle conversion, too.

The pods looks alright, as missile launchers.

Fix the textures, they're not meshing together though.
 
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