Thrakhath and Hobbes

[Jason_Ryock]

In all the seether fight was pretty bland though. Usually a full missile salvo on the first pass is enough to take him out.

I found that generally true about all the Ace Fights I flew in, though.

 

[Gamer8585]

In all the seether fight was pretty bland though. Usually a full missile salvo on the first pass is enough to take him out.

Yeah. They built up Seether throughout the game, but when you finally get to fight him he's little more than an annoyance. At that point you have better things to do and destroy him without much thought or passion. It would have been great if Setteter was a hard fight to get though. If he was a very good pilot and really kept you on your toes and if he could do that trick with the mines and afterburners that we saw in cutscenes (and that I actually tried to do in Wing 4 [note: doesn't work]).

IMO Maniac was the only really challenging fight in the game (I still only have about a 50% success rate against him).

I found that generally true about all the Ace Fights I flew in, though.

I agree with you there about the wing 3/4 aces who felt just tacked on. However I feel the ace's in Wing 1 and 2 were very challenging.

For example: Baruk Starkiller in his little Salthi was very difficult to kill. You had to protect a Drayman and on the way back to the Claw Starkiller and 2 other Salthi (IIRC) ambush you. You have to keep the Drayman alive, and also kill the enemy fighters. But while the other Salthi go down quick Starkiller pulls some epic shit type flying, and if you damage him too much he runs away (his Salthi is far faster than your Scimitar). So it usually comes down to save the Drayman and let Starkiller escape, or focus on killing the ace while the other 2 Salthi waste the Drayman. Its not impossible to do both, but it dose require a bit of skill and luck (and remembering that the Salthi likes to turn left due to engine design).


Back on topic: I think that the thing that really irks me about the "personality overlay" thing is that it was completely unnecessary. I would have been fine with Hobbes betraying the Confederation after he found out what they were going to do to Kilrah. Sure you can betray your side when you think they're wrong, but when the side you defect to wants to blow up your hometown...well that's going to cause some internal conflict. It must not have been easy for Hobbes at Confed and he was most likely already filled with doubt about betraying the Kilrathi. To turn back to the Kats after he learned of what the Behemoth (and later the T-bomb) was for would be a natural and understandable reaction. The whole thing about Thrakath leaving him alive in SO1 can be explained by: 1) He didn't have time to finish off Hobbes, and/or 2) he was gambling that Hobbes would one day turn back and the information he would bring about Confed would be very valuable.

 

[rapierdragon]

Originally Posted by Jason_Ryock
There's a quote floating around somewhere (From Fleet Action?) where one of the Kilrathi mentions that aside from the Strakha stealth fighters most of the Human Fighters are superior to theirs.

Yup, and the stealth fighters only real advantage was their cloak... their weapons sucked somewhat, so they only had a "real" advantage when they could gang up on terran fighters so the terran shields didn't get any chances to recharge. Ultimately the best advantage was that the stealth fighters could be armed with skip-killing torpedoes (or ship-killing missiles or whatever it was atm)

I'm pretty sure it was mentioned in Victory Streak as well that the
Kilrathi had superior numbers, while Confed had superior fire-power and manoeuvrability.

I've played enough 4x4 turn sims to know what in this case it's actually a more balanced fight than most people realize.

TERRANS: better weapons, better maneuvering, slightly more shields
KILRATHI: superior numbers, slightly more armor (on med+heavy fighters at least)

FIGHT ODDS: roughly 50/50 with each battle getting advantage depending on location tactics (asteroids, moons to hid behind, nebula, etc) and whichever side had better pilots (Kats usually had more but the lower-nobility pilots usually had poorer training)

THE TIE BREAKER: The tie-breaker in most 4x4 games turns to be the stealth fighter with its cap-ship killing ability. Had the Kilrathi managed to get enough Strakha in operation the battle would go from 50/50 to more like 15/85 (humans loosing badly)

 

[Max Gene]

For example: Baruk Starkiller in his little Salthi was very difficult to kill. You had to protect a Drayman and on the way back to the Claw Starkiller and 2 other Salthi (IIRC) ambush you. You have to keep the Drayman alive, and also kill the enemy fighters. But while the other Salthi go down quick Starkiller pulls some epic shit type flying, and if you damage him too much he runs away (his Salthi is far faster than your Scimitar). So it usually comes down to save the Drayman and let Starkiller escape, or focus on killing the ace while the other 2 Salthi waste the Drayman. Its not impossible to do both, but it dose require a bit of skill and luck (and remembering that the Salthi likes to turn left due to engine design).

I had the worst trouble with him at first, but I can get 80% success rate on both conditions these days. Just point yourself at him immediately and squeeze the trigger. One empty gun battery later, he's breathing vacuum. Throw in a dumbfire for giggles and he doesn't stand a chance. The key is to make him do his initial head-on attack while you're still next to the drayman.

 

[Mace]

WC1's engine makes aces easy to kill.... same thing with 2("boxing" system).

WC2's thrakhath, actually appeared to have a missile lock on you at the moment you are in-flight.... dogfight him close and you can beat him, easy

WC3 was the hardest(fighting flash)

WC4, i played through it on veteran, and since someone mentioned the seether mission, i have to say when back then(1996), I resetted to the highest level, and flew the mission again... I made him "my bitch", strafing his shields and turning every bit of his fighter red... yeah I wanted him dead too. He IS a hard one to kill(and appears to have unlimited missiles?)

Prophecy does not have those level aces to engage.

 

[Gamer8585]

Prophecy does not have those level aces to engage.

Personally I've always had more trouble with the bugs than with the Kats. WCP dose have aces, they're just not named (probably due to lack of intel about the bugs). Devil Ray's had ace variants (they were red ships IIRC) that IMO were hard to kill, they flight tactics were more varied and their ships seemed to be superior.

 

[Durandal]

Personally I've always had more trouble with the bugs than with the Kats. WCP dose have aces, they're just not named (probably due to lack of intel about the bugs). Devil Ray's had ace variants (they were red ships IIRC) that IMO were hard to kill, they flight tactics were more varied and their ships seemed to be superior.

Just meant to push the player that much harder, I suspect. I didn't much care for the bug aces, but that's mostly because my view is that leaving them unnamed left it a bit empty when you beat it. You down a Kilrathi ace, you can gloat about it, saying you downed Starkiller (or whichever ace you dropped). With the bugs, it's "I squashed a particularly persistant bug."

 

[Bandit LOAF]

As for Thrakhath not killing Hobbes... yeah, there was the whole sleeper thing, which may or may not have existed at the time (SO1 was written before WC3 so the sleeper thing may have been a plot idea/twist by a seperate writer or maybe the writer had the idea in-mind when SO1 was done)...

My pure speculation would be that the two aren't connected. Although basic plans for Wing Commander III existed in 1991, they were scrapped very early on when the project became a long-term relaunch of sorts. There was a lot of turnover on the team in those 36 months and Wing Commander III's story was developed by an entirely different group of writers (and certainly, Wing Commander III seems to go through some pains to *ignore* the Special Operations stories.) It's just one of those great coincidences -- it was a cheap device in Special Operations that makes us go Hmmm now. Another one is the introduction to Freedom Flight, where Thrakhath frees Ralgha... it's mighty suspicious, but only in retrospect.

Now, it is possible that this was a plot point planned for Wing Commander 3-1992... but it seems unlikely, given Hobbes' set up and given the different sets of writers on all of these projects.

Best example off the top of my head comes from the Man-Kzin wars book: Destiny's Forge.

Heh, I read that recently -- and we all had Destiny's Forge temporary tattoos at Dragon*Con a few years back...

Thrakhath would have been pretty pissed off when they were re-introduced on the bonnie heather , and the coward he found in a cell on a pirate base had been responsible for the destruction of the Sivar weapon and the execution of his father

I'm willing to bet that if you showed someone a picture of Blair in Academy and Blair in Special Operations 1 that they wouldn't be able to tell you it was the same person

Actually making calls to blair would make sense, since blair would have been his personal demon, and in the final mission of WC2, he wants to "Take care of that pest" himself.

He did! Thrakhath sent Blair a threatening letter after his father's death -- it's printed in the Kilrathi Saga manual (which is apparently also the earliest reference to 'Heart of the Tiger' in terms of the timeline)!

When you do chase after him(which I did, because it would seem the right thing to do, Cobra was in need of medical attention and near death, and you are an ace fighter pilot, not a medic),

At the same time, Eisen orders you *not* to go -- and you're an ace fighter pilot, not the ranking Admiral.

As it seems to work in a similar way with Kilrathi, the end result is that Thrakhath only had a single sleeper to work with, but was convincing enough to be accepted by Terran command.

Moreover, it only *works* once -- if you spent a thousand cat hours and a thousand cat money units on a thousand sleeper agents, you're still only going to get (at most?) *one* back. The minute that first Hobbes turns out to be a spy the other 999 get sent to cat jails.

As far as the whole movie side of this thread seems to go, I've a single question:
Any other StarLancer players here besides me catch the piece of WC movie footage used in SL's first newscast?

Yeah... but they earned it. The Digital Anvil team did a heck of a lot of work on that movie.

another side note; on the back of the PC deluxe CD deluxe edition of wing commander 2 you see an image(screenshot) of WC1-blair's face with the debriefing background that was normally paired with halcyons face, mentioning that he did not destroy the tiger's claw, that scene was not in the game! probaby been discussed before, but what's the story behind that screenshot?

I don't think it's the debriefing background -- it seems to be cameras taking flash photos of him. The original scene would have been set just after his trial ended, with Tolwyn ordering him to ISS right outside.

I'm pretty sure this is just an old version of the WC2 intro using the original WC1 talking heads before those graphics were updated.

Other way around -- what you're looking at is the more complex version of the game, with graphic elements cut to save space on the diskettes. By moving the scene to Tolwyn's office and by using the WC2 "old Blair" graphic instead of the WC1 version you have one less talking head and one less background. (That version makes a lot more sense -- by using the WC2 Blair in 2655 he ages a decade in a few months and then not at all again in the next ten years.)

The bottom line though, is that when the 29th century encyclopeida (wikipedia?) of war history comes out, underneath the entry for "traitor" you'd better see a picture of Ralgha nar Hhallas.

I don't know, it might have Jazz... or that guy from the WC:CCG traitor card. I'm also sure that the 29th century Wikipedia talk page would be having exactly this argument.

Christ, even Benedict Arnold only betrayed one side.

British Soldier -> Revolutionary -> British Soldier -- that's two, too.

2.) I found Paladin's reaction to Hobbes betrayal strange; in that it was non existent. These two were close friends in Wc2, remember, so when it turns out to be a bunch of BS, you think he'd at least have SOMETHING to say to Blair about it. Maybe it's cause he had other things on his mind. Maybe it's cause he's a general on his way towards being a senator and has learned to tune out concepts like friendship and loyalty. Probably a bit of both. Either way it was strange and somewhat distressing. Interestingly, both the novel and the wc3 script have Paladin on the flight deck with a mortally wounded Cobra, playing the role that Eisen filled in the game.

It's hard to tell when the Wing Commander III script is just ignorant of Wing Commander II and when it's intentionally changing a relationship. I do feel somewhat that this was intentional, and that we're supposed to see that Paladin is becoming a lot less of the buddy he once was (or perhaps he's becoming more of the spy he always was.) Of course, at the same time I would never have ended WC1 expecting to see Paladin as my pal in the next game either...

I also wonder what was with naming a character "Blair" in Freedom Flight but that's another topic...

We now know that, improbably, that was intentional - there's a Point of Origin that refers to the character circa 1991 as "Arturo Blair" (a shortening of Our Hero Blue-Hair).

Just meant to push the player that much harder, I suspect. I didn't much care for the bug aces, but that's mostly because my view is that leaving them unnamed left it a bit empty when you beat it. You down a Kilrathi ace, you can gloat about it, saying you downed Starkiller (or whichever ace you dropped). With the bugs, it's "I squashed a particularly persistant bug."

I agree, but I'll also note that this started a lot earlier than anyone remembers... with the Drakhai in Secret Missions 2 (and I think the worst offender is Wing Commander IV. Although it had various plot aces - Seether, Vagabond, etc. - it also had those nasty *unnamed* ones. 'Hellcat Ace,' 'Banshee Ace,' and so forth. Of all the settings where you *should* have known your foe, that was it...

 

[Max Gene]

Something JUST occurred to me, although I'm sure at least one person is going to tell me to stop idiotically crossing my references...

Hobbes wasn't wearing a red shirt.

 

[Gamer8585]

Something JUST occurred to me, although I'm sure at least one person is going to tell me to stop idiotically crossing my references...

Hobbes wasn't wearing a red shirt.

...well Hobbes wasn't a "red shirt", so...

 

[Quarto]

Perhaps I did stretch a bit on that one, but I'm going to try to defend myself anyway.

I think one of the problems is that we're not really talking about the same things -it's a question of terms. You say "metaphor", but you don't really mean a metaphor. A metaphor is like an analogy - so Wing Commander might be a metaphor for World War II. What you're talking about is not metaphors, but particular aspects of Wing Commander. These aspects in some cases are important to the games and the series as a whole, but none of the things you identify are so representative that they could be used as an analogy for what the entire series is about. You can't really say that Wing Commander is like a duel - those duels, when they do show up, are considered important... but if anything, Wing Commander as a whole is the exact opposite of a duel. The player does not go through a series of one-on-one duels, rather he goes through a gauntlet.

That is to say, in the purest gameplay terms, when deprived of the storyline, Wing Commander comes down to the single-player gauntlet in WC Academy or WC Armada - the player stands alone against increasing odds.

You're right Wing Commander games are not about enemies being accused of treason (they're about blowing shit up in a big war with an interesting story between sorties). I was merely try to set up a parallel between Maverick and Hobbes. They were both accused of treason, but neither one of them betrayed their side: no one believed Blair about the Stealth fighters, and Hobbes' "defection" was part of a covert assignment. They were both accused of treason by their kind, but were really very patriotic and their circumstances were misunderstood. Treason also gained a large foothold in the overall theme of Wing Commander in Wing 2. There was Jazz, Minx, Hobbes, the rebel Kilrathi planets, the Mandarins. In Wing 3 Hobbes' betrays Confed and...well that's the topic of this thread. In Wing 4 Blair defects to the Border Worlds, Tolwyn betrays the very values that Confed defended in the war against the Kilrathi.

I don't disagree with the fact that treason plays a large role in Wing Commander, but the parallel you're trying to set up does not exist. There's a very significant difference between Blair and Hobbes - Blair is accused of treason, but he is falsely accused. Hobbes isn't falsely accused - twice, he is accused of treason, and in each case, the accusation is completely true. When he returns to the Kilrathi in WC3, this does not undo his previous betrayal, it does not mean that he had never betrayed them. He did, he fought against the Kilrathi, he played a huge role in encouraging the rebellion on those Kilrathi planets in WC2, and he fought against the Kilrathi during some of the most crucial battles of the war. During all this time, he was not a double agent - he was a gunuine soldier of the Confederation. It's only following the trigger that he became a Kilrathi agent - so in effect, the trigger didn't undo his first treason, but added a second treason to the deal.

I disagree. Duty is the core issue of every solider in every war. Sometimes its more overt than others, but even in Wing 1 there are issues of duty and personal feelings conflicting. In Wing 3 Hobbes betrays the Confederation because it was the mission he was assigned (even if it did make him feel like shit). In Wing 4 Tolwyn sets up the Black Lance and engages in acts of war, because he believed that is was the best way to preserve the Confederation. The conflict of congruence of duty and personal feelings is there, sometimes overt, sometimes subtle.

Again, I don't question that duty is something that appears in Wing Commander, and can sometimes be quite significant. But, it's not what Wing Commander as a whole is about. Duty is a relatively minor theme in Wing Commander. The conflict you mention, it does exist, but it's always a small deal. You don't hear characters anguishing about whether to choose duty or personal feelings - when the time comes to choose, the game is neither consistent, nor subtle in telling you which should be chosen. It's not even consistent in explaining particular choices - when you defect in WC4, it's clearly explained as a matter of personal feelings ("I'm not firing on the Captain!")... and then, when confronting Tolwyn, Blair claims that it was his duty...

1. I never said it did come down to one final duel, I said it would in the scenario I outlined.

Hehe, don't you think that's a bit silly? I could just as easily argue that if there was no duel with Thrakhath in WC3, the WC2 duel would be a unique feature of WC2. We can argue about what a game is about based on... well, what it's about. We can't argue about what a game is about based on what we'd like it to be.

 

[Delance]

Jazz is the big traitor, he was human. Hobbes, even doing it twice, ended up where he started. Quality over quantity.

 

[Nomad Terror]

I wonder if Hobbes would have faced trust issues trying to reintegrate into Kilrathi society had he lived long enough to do so.

I mean, if you have a friend who one day turns his back on you then some time later comes back to you saying he's your friend again, you might not trust him very much for a while.

Very few people probably liked Hobbes at that point.

 

[Gamer8585]

I think one of the problems is that we're not really talking about the same things -it's a question of terms. You say "metaphor", but you don't really mean a metaphor. A metaphor is like an analogy - so Wing Commander might be a metaphor for World War II. What you're talking about is not metaphors, but particular aspects of Wing Commander. These aspects in some cases are important to the games and the series as a whole, but none of the things you identify are so representative that they could be used as an analogy for what the entire series is about. You can't really say that Wing Commander is like a duel - those duels, when they do show up, are considered important... but if anything, Wing Commander as a whole is the exact opposite of a duel. The player does not go through a series of one-on-one duels, rather he goes through a gauntlet.

I was talking about the aspects in aggregate (not individually) being a metaphor for the Wing games up to that point.

That is to say, in the purest gameplay terms, when deprived of the storyline, Wing Commander comes down to the single-player gauntlet in WC Academy or WC Armada - the player stands alone against increasing odds.

Also when deprived of the storyline almost all games come down to a bland "kill-everything-that's-shooting-at-you-until-they-either-stop-shooting-at-you-or-you-die." scenario.

I don't disagree with the fact that treason plays a large role in Wing Commander, but the parallel you're trying to set up does not exist. There's a very significant difference between Blair and Hobbes - Blair is accused of treason, but he is falsely accused. Hobbes isn't falsely accused - twice, he is accused of treason, and in each case, the accusation is completely true. When he returns to the Kilrathi in WC3, this does not undo his previous betrayal, it does not mean that he had never betrayed them. He did, he fought against the Kilrathi, he played a huge role in encouraging the rebellion on those Kilrathi planets in WC2, and he fought against the Kilrathi during some of the most crucial battles of the war. During all this time, he was not a double agent - he was a gunuine soldier of the Confederation. It's only following the trigger that he became a Kilrathi agent - so in effect, the trigger didn't undo his first treason, but added a second treason to the deal.

With Hobbes there is one caveat though. He was a "genuine soldier of the Confederation" only as long a Thrakath wished him to be. IIRC Ralga knew what the personality overlay would do to him and he accepted the assignment for the express purpose of advancing the cause of the Empire of Kilrathi. IT wasn't double treason because Ralga nar Hallas was acting all along in the best interests of the Kilrathi empire. They wanted him to be accepted by the Confederation so the would have a mole inside to leak valuable intel when the time was right. They knew he would fight their side, but they wanted him to. They wanted him to become trusted and decorated. Thrakath essentially wrote off the deaths of all the other Kilrathi pilots as pawns to be sacrificed. You can't really betray your side when you're following your orders to the letter. Many of the Kilrathi did not know this about Ralga and assumed he was a traitor (which is why they tried to try to shoot him down). With Blair no one believed him about the stealth fighters and assumed he willfully disregarded his duty and let the Tiger's Claw be destroyed. Both of their peoples assumed they were traitors, but they were both following their orders the best they could.

Again, I don't question that duty is something that appears in Wing Commander, and can sometimes be quite significant. But, it's not what Wing Commander as a whole is about. Duty is a relatively minor theme in Wing Commander. The conflict you mention, it does exist, but it's always a small deal. You don't hear characters anguishing about whether to choose duty or personal feelings - when the time comes to choose, the game is neither consistent, nor subtle in telling you which should be chosen. It's not even consistent in explaining particular choices - when you defect in WC4, it's clearly explained as a matter of personal feelings ("I'm not firing on the Captain!")... and then, when confronting Tolwyn, Blair claims that it was his duty...

The story of Wing Commander has had its fair share of issues of duty. Such as the ones you point out. I'm not saying that it tries to impart a moral, but like any war book/movie/game the issue of duty is still there. In greater or lesser qualities, but they permeate the very subject matter. And like other stories there is sometimes conflict with personal feelings.

Hehe, don't you think that's a bit silly? I could just as easily argue that if there was no duel with Thrakhath in WC3, the WC2 duel would be a unique feature of WC2. We can argue about what a game is about based on... well, what it's about. We can't argue about what a game is about based on what we'd like it to be.

I wasn't saying that's what the game was about. I was outlining a scenario that I thought would be IMO better dramatically. It would IMO be a culmination of many of the gameplay elements and themes theretofore seen in the Wing games. If there was no duel with Thrakhath in WC3 then it would be, denotatively, a unique feature of WC2, because that would be the only game in which you duel Thrakhath....

I wonder if Hobbes would have faced trust issues trying to reintegrate into Kilrathi society had he lived long enough to do so.

He probably would have been the "Savior of Kilrah" if he lived thanks to leaking the plans for the Behemoth. Although if he lived, and the war turned out the same way, it would be very awkward for him around any members of the Confederation (especially Blair...).

 

[AD]

The story of Wing Commander has had its fair share of issues of duty. Such as the ones you point out. I'm not saying that it tries to impart a moral, but like any war book/movie/game the issue of duty is still there. In greater or lesser qualities, but they permeate the very subject matter. And like other stories there is sometimes conflict with personal feelings.

In WC2 and the movie both present you, the main character as rather brash and willing to ignore his duty on personal whims, though he ultimately does the right thing.

On the other hand, Borst and Depalma make blair out to be all for Duty in WC3,4 because he apparently wants the spotlight.

WC4 goes further though and and presents duty, while maybe not in name, as a central idea behind the story. Eisen says as much to blair shortly before he defects, essentially telling blair that his ultimate duty is to all of humanity and not specifically just following orders from confed (which is having a hard time letting go of control). In some ways it's kind of the same logic that motivates tolwyn to justify commiting attrocities as somehow improving humanity .

I would say that ultimately, WC4 is the odd duck out in the grander WC scheme of things anyway though.

 

[Delance]

He probably would have been the "Savior of Kilrah" if he lived thanks to leaking the plans for the Behemoth.

I disagree, Kilrathi wouldn't rank a spy as high as that, it appears. Even if he was a great pilot, his main accomplishment was a result of treason, what is dishonorable.

Although if he lived, and the war turned out the same way, it would be very awkward for him around any members of the Confederation (especially Blair...).

Social awkwardness should be the least of his problems, since they would very likely execute him for treason - he was a Confed colonel, after all.

 

[Nomad Terror]

He probably would have been the "Savior of Kilrah" if he lived thanks to leaking the plans for the Behemoth.

Someone who killed as many Kilrathi as he did?

The first episode of Academy shows us quite frankly the Kilrathi's attitude towards treason. Even the Mandarin movement Thrakhath was just exploiting to get his hands on a Morningstar.

Double agents generally have to be the bad guy to everyone in order to perform their duty, and Hobbes was even worse than that. He willfully betrayed the Kilrathi. Even if it was an overlayed personality that caused him to do so, he still willfully did so.

The general populace would not have known about Thrakhath's scheme to get him deep inside Confed before reawakening his actual personality. Even post-WC3, did anyone ever get the chance to pass on the word that Hobbes was actually a double agent? Did the rest of the Kilrathi live on thinking that he was just purely a traitor to Kilrah? Would Thrakhath had made it known if they had lived? Would that change public opinion about him?

 

[Gamer8585]

I disagree, Kilrathi wouldn't rank a spy as high as that, it appears. Even if he was a great pilot, his main accomplishment was a result of treason, what is dishonorable.

You can't be a traitor (in the basic sense) when you're following orders from your faction's leader.

Social awkwardness should be the least of his problems, since they would very likely execute him for treason - he was a Confed colonel, after all.

Yeah, that was my attempt at humor. Apparently I failed like a Hornet against a Tiamat.

Someone who killed as many Kilrathi as he did?

The first episode of Academy shows us quite frankly the Kilrathi's attitude towards treason. Even the Mandarin movement Thrakhath was just exploiting to get his hands on a Morningstar.

Double agents generally have to be the bad guy to everyone in order to perform their duty, and Hobbes was even worse than that. He willfully betrayed the Kilrathi. Even if it was an overlayed personality that caused him to do so, he still willfully did so.

The general populace would not have known about Thrakhath's scheme to get him deep inside Confed before reawakening his actual personality. Even post-WC3, did anyone ever get the chance to pass on the word that Hobbes was actually a double agent? Did the rest of the Kilrathi live on thinking that he was just purely a traitor to Kilrah? Would Thrakhath had made it known if they had lived? Would that change public opinion about him?

The difference about the traitor in Red vs. Blue was that he was doing it for personal gain. The Mandarins were being exploited as gullible pawns by the Kilrathi (overall not just for the Morningstar).

Ralga nar Hallas willfully subjected himself to the personality overlay, but afterward he was "brainwashed" into betraying the Kilrathi. When the brainwashing was removed and his true personality came out he did everything he could to advance the cause of the Empire of Kilrah.

While the rank and file Kilrathi did not know about Ralga's true assignment initially, if the Kilrathi won his story would have most likely come out and he would have been hailed as a hero. If the Confederation won, most likely Ralga would have joined the "Cult of Sivar" and spread the true story of what happened.

We know little about the Kilrathi code of honor. It seems to be an "anything goes as long as it helps your side win" type thing.

 

[Delance]

You can't be a traitor (in the basic sense) when you're following orders from your faction's leader.

And what if your faction's leader orders you to betray your faction?

 

[Mace]

We know little about the Kilrathi code of honor. It seems to be an "anything goes as long as it helps your side win" type thing.

How many of you chose to go chase down hobbes, and how many chose to hold cobra's hand as she died?

A story is a story, and the way you tell the tail, I chased down hobbes, and i found that "something was not right"

I found Rhalga nar Hallas informing me of the way we are supposed to meet..

While Hobbes was only a part of Rhalga, all of Hobbes was inside Rhalga?, his memories when you were at thesame side, fighting alongside together, talking...

Hobbes, in my opinion did not betray anyone, he completed his mission, he only found that his masked opinion had found a friend in Maverick, and did not realise it himself, but more then a little, he learned to respect his human friends over the years, and everything of that remains intact.