Looking for volunteers for a WCTO test game

Ironduke

Spaceman
While I am very well aware that the Terrans do not stand any chance against us, I think you shame them by trying to help them in such an obvious way. :p
Is there still a way I can proof that I'm a neutral game master? :D;)
(I won't tell you my dice rolls now, but: According to WC lore, the Beowulf must be destroyed. Somehow. :p)
 

Avacar

Vice Admiral
Ironduke, I've submitted my orders by email, but it's not flagged. As far as I know, I did it before Panda did. If you didn't get them, let me know and I'll resend.
 

Ironduke

Spaceman
Panda's called me in as a wingman. Could Ironduke to put me in Tango 3?
Done! Welcome to the TCSF, pilot! ;)

Ironduke, I've submitted my orders by email, but it's not flagged. As far as I know, I did it before Panda did. If you didn't get them, let me know and I'll resend.
That's a negative, I just received your email with the FF missile question. Please resend it!
 

Avacar

Vice Admiral
Hey Ironduke, why does it say Tango 3 is targetting Karactu2? Shouldn't that:
A) Only be revealed after everyone's declared their movement
B) Be impossible to do from where they are? Wouldn't an FF go for one of the fighters, and Tango 3 is in the wrong position to get an HS lock on Karactu2?
 

Ironduke

Spaceman
Hey Ironduke, why does it say Tango 3 is targetting Karactu2? Shouldn't that:
A) Only be revealed after everyone's declared their movement
B) Be impossible to do from where they are? Wouldn't an FF go for one of the fighters, and Tango 3 is in the wrong position to get an HS lock on Karactu2?
Koractu 2 targeted Tango 3 in his first turn, but it's not what you might think: This just denotes that Tango 3 is locked in the Grikath's targeting computer. (Think of pressing "L" in the PC games to lock a target instead of just pressing "T" to toggle through targets.)
It doesn't mean Koractu 2 has a missile lock on Tango 3, it's just that he's "watching" him. (Think "Meet the Parents" now. :p)

As for Koractu 2, he'll soon enough switch to lock on the TCS Beowulf to start aiming his torpedo. I just wanted to demonstrate how "target locking" works and remind you that you need a target lock whenever you want to fire an IR, torp or HS (hint, hint!). So in a nutshell: No, it doesn't mean anything in-game for Koractu 2. ;)

I was waiting for somebody to bust that one out...
And so was I... :D
 

Ironduke

Spaceman
I'll post this in a new reply to clearly separate it:

WCTO Game 003 has a new turn online. If it wasn't for the asteroid, Pip would have gotten lighted up by QuailPilot's lasers by now. :p

And the big one: Scenario 001 Combat Phase is online, and it seems space is littered with missiles right now. ;)
I'll sum it up quickly:

- Tango 1: One DF coming his way, but he wisely preserved his lasers for point-defense fire. Might come in handy now!
- Tango 2: One FF from Koractu 2 headed his way.
- Vorshaki 2: One DF from Tango 1, and a total of three, I repeat: three FF missiles coming in from Koractu 1, Tango 2 and Tango 3.

QuailPilot: Take it easy! In case you die this turn, you could still hop in Koractu 2's cockpit. :p

And now I'll open my package from the CIC birthday party which arrived some 30 minutes ago. WOOHOO! :D
 

Mekt-Hakkikt

Mpanty's bane
See, that's why I sent you the FF warning. ;)

But: Ironduke, please before resolving any turn check the email I sent you a few minutes ago - maybe we got it all wrong. Or only I did and then Quailpilot: you'll die as a warrior!
 

Ironduke

Spaceman
But: Ironduke, please before resolving any turn check the email I sent you a few minutes ago - maybe we got it all wrong. Or only I did and then Quailpilot: you'll die as a warrior!
Don't worry, everything is a-ok. Except for Vorshaki 2, but he can still do some evasive maneuvers or drop a chaff pod or something. ;)

Oh, concerning chaff pods: I noticed that, in the current version of the manual, chaff pods are not limited to rear fire arc use. That seemed so obvious to me that I simply forgot to mention it in the rules! I'll get that right in an updated version, but for the time being I'd say you're allowed to use chaff pods in any arc - my fault!
 

Avacar

Vice Admiral
Don't worry, everything is a-ok. Except for Vorshaki 2, but he can still do some evasive maneuvers or drop a chaff pod or something. ;)

Oh, concerning chaff pods: I noticed that, in the current version of the manual, chaff pods are not limited to rear fire arc use. That seemed so obvious to me that I simply forgot to mention it in the rules! I'll get that right in an updated version, but for the time being I'd say you're allowed to use chaff pods in any arc - my fault!

Right, good to know, because I was definitely banking on a chaff pod to avoid the (rather evident) FF from Koractu 2.

Also it would be nice, if it isn't a lot of work, for you to update the ship stats even after the combat phase so that we can get a full view of the situation in the end-turn phase in the cases where we have to wait on other's orders like this.

Also I need clarification: are the DFs resolved in the combat phase? Did I miss that in the manual? while I do agree this makes more sense (since they are fast and have no guidance) it wasn't clear. This would be important, because in what order to missiles acquire targets? If DFs were done in the end-turn phase, a few situations could occur. Example: My missile locks on Vorshaku 2, Vorshaku 2's DF hits Tango 1, doing hull damage, Tango 3's FF locks on Tango 1, etc. The order of missile resolution suddenly matters. Resolving DF fire in the combat phase (as you did) fixes this problem, but near as I can tell, this isn't explicitly stated in the manual.

(Open Channel)
Koractu 1 this is Tango 2. I don't know how you do it back home, but here, we call that kill stealing! Uorshaki 2 is mine!
 

Ironduke

Spaceman
Hm, sorry, I just noticed that evasive maneuvers don't really count in QuailPilot's situation. He'd head right off the map if he hit his afterburners...
Releasing a chaff pod is still a possibility, though!

Also it would be nice, if it isn't a lot of work, for you to update the ship stats even after the combat phase so that we can get a full view of the situation in the end-turn phase in the cases where we have to wait on other's orders like this.
I did! Maybe you have to refresh your browser window/cache, not too sure about that. (In the Ship Stats screen, try hitting F5 on most browsers.) You should notice that I already substracted all the missiles that have been launched, and I also updated the status on shields and hull strength for Tango 1 and Vorshaki 2. Tell me if it doesn't work for you (or anyone else, for that matter)!

Also I need clarification: are the DFs resolved in the combat phase? Did I miss that in the manual? while I do agree this makes more sense (since they are fast and have no guidance) it wasn't clear. This would be important, because in what order to missiles acquire targets? If DFs were done in the end-turn phase, a few situations could occur. Example: My missile locks on Vorshaku 2, Vorshaku 2's DF hits Tango 1, doing hull damage, Tango 3's FF locks on Tango 1, etc. The order of missile resolution suddenly matters. Resolving DF fire in the combat phase (as you did) fixes this problem, but near as I can tell, this isn't explicitly stated in the manual.
Uh, no, I didn't resolve DF hits or misses during Combat Phase. I just stated that DF missiles had been launched. The DF missiles are still out there, same as the FF missiles. The FFs lock onto their respective targets at the beginning of each turn's End Phase.

I agree, it's not worked out very well in the manual, but since I had no opportunity to play-test the game so far, these issues haven't arisen until now. Remember, it's still just sort of a beta test, so we're ultimately all playing to pin-point these weak spots. :)

While we're at it, I have a few more issues I'll have to address in the manual's next version. Feel free to comment:

- the general procedure of locking missiles and torpedos must be explained
- FF missiles lock on after Combat Phase, in the beginning of End Phase
- chaff pods should be restricted to rear fire arc use
- torpedoes should get the same firing arc as DF missiles (only straight ahead, OR a 60° arc)
- evasive maneuvers should allow for afterburning away straight ahead, no matter if afterburners have been used during Movement Phase or not. However, no movement will be allowed in the following turn's Movement Phase
- point-defense fire: Flak fire will destroy missiles on a 8+ instead of a 5+
 

Panda

Spaceman
- the general procedure of locking missiles and torpedos must be explained
- FF missiles lock on after Combat Phase, in the beginning of End Phase
- chaff pods should be restricted to rear fire arc use
- torpedoes should get the same firing arc as DF missiles (only straight ahead, OR a 60° arc)
- evasive maneuvers should allow for afterburning away straight ahead, no matter if afterburners have been used during Movement Phase or not. However, no movement will be allowed in the following turn's Movement Phase
- point-defense fire: Flak fire will destroy missiles on a 8+ instead of a 5+[/QUOTE]



I think straight ahead is too restrictive, it's very hard to set up a run like that. Oblique torpedo runs were a big part of WC, too. I vote for either a 60 degree arc or possibly something like the opportunity fire arc - a narrow corridor three hexes wide.

Also, why did you give the dedicated carriers antimatter guns?

I'm very happy to be a beta tester, and I'm having a lot of fun with this!
 

snip63

Spaceman
I did! Maybe you have to refresh your browser window/cache, not too sure about that. (In the Ship Stats screen, try hitting F5 on most browsers.)

I made sure to hit F5 and, while I see the fired missiles gone and afterburner fuel has been used, there is no change in the damage to shields/hull.
 

Avacar

Vice Admiral
Uh, no, I didn't resolve DF hits or misses during Combat Phase. I just stated that DF missiles had been launched. The DF missiles are still out there, same as the FF missiles. The FFs lock onto their respective targets at the beginning of each turn's End Phase.

I agree, it's not worked out very well in the manual, but since I had no opportunity to play-test the game so far, these issues haven't arisen until now. Remember, it's still just sort of a beta test, so we're ultimately all playing to pin-point these weak spots. :)

Aha, see, if I'd understood the above, I wouldn't have hesitated to fire my FFs off, because there was no way the opposing force could do enough damage to Tango 1 to hit his hull before my FF locked targets. That said, what you describe above here makes the most logical sense from a 'what's going on' sense.

While we're at it, I have a few more issues I'll have to address in the manual's next version. Feel free to comment:

- the general procedure of locking missiles and torpedos must be explained
- FF missiles lock on after Combat Phase, in the beginning of End Phase
- chaff pods should be restricted to rear fire arc use
- torpedoes should get the same firing arc as DF missiles (only straight ahead, OR a 60° arc)
- evasive maneuvers should allow for afterburning away straight ahead, no matter if afterburners have been used during Movement Phase or not. However, no movement will be allowed in the following turn's Movement Phase
- point-defense fire: Flak fire will destroy missiles on a 8+ instead of a 5+

On these points, I definitely agree in reducing the torpedo arc to 60. I wouldn't reduce it to DF though. At 120, they have far too much ability to maintain a target lock, even in close quarters.
I think chaff pods should have side and rear arc uses, since argueably if the missile is coming from far enough away, the chaff will appear as second target beside my target from a side-arc. Perhaps reduce their effectiveness from a side-arc approach?
To clarify your second-last point, using the afterburner as evasive action only costs you your movement on the next turn if you've "double-fired" them (as in used them once in the turn already)?

Also, I think Quailpilot is more than welcome to use afterburners to evade these missiles. Since he's going to die anyway, he's also welcome to be a coward and flee the battle permanently!
 
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