Landreich's fleet?

frostytheplebe

Seventh Part of the Seal
I was just wondering if we ever had a full spectrum of the size of their fleet. I know the Free Republic got the Tarawa and a number of other CVEs and perhaps some cruisers and destroyers, but was that it? Did they ever develop their own design of ships?

Also, I'm still waiting to get my hands on Fleet Action... was the Concordia taken off line during the armistice? If so, why didn't Landriech try to purchase her?
 
I can't remember if the Concordia was taken off line or not for the Armistace, but I really don't think so. As for the Landreich buying her. No way in hell would the Confederation stand for it. I mean there's a huge difference between selling off a couple of CVEs and selling your best dreadnaught.

Actually, I don't think the CVEs were sold to the Landriech in Fleet Action either, just put on loan. I was under the impression that the Tarawa went back to Confederation Service for some time before being reaquired by the FRL some time just before False Colors.
 
I think it is going to depend on what time frame you look at,
Of the ships that are in the Landreich fleet,
Fleet Action references that Kruger took his Confed Destroyer (which is now the Flagship of the FRL fleet in Fleet Action) with him, when he disobeyed Confed orders to stay behind and defend the systems of the republic during the early years of the war.

Of course, FRL acquired five CVE that you know about (Tarawa and Normandy are the only two I can remember of the top of my head) in the course of the book, although that was part of a greater scheme by Confed Fleet Intelligence me thinks, who suspected the Armistice was a fraud and that the Kilrathi were building up a fleet (Although Confed had a truce with the Kilrathi, the FRL didn’t) I won’t go into details and spoil it as it’s a good read.
Fleet Action reference various fighters that Landreich had put together, real spit and glue affairs, such as a ferret with a Corvette engine attached to it!!!
I can’t recall the book going into specifics on the rest of the fleet capital ships however.

In false Colours, Landreich also acquires wartime Kilrathi Bhantkara class heavy carrier which they repair and put into service, along with various kilrathi fighters which were part of the Bhantkara’s complement, they also seize a Kilrathi picket ship in the book, but it doesn’t go into detail in about its fate.

In terms of your other question, Confed were in the process of mothballing the fleet as part of the Armistice agreement (there is more to it than that, but again I won’t spoil it for you) and had pulled the reactors on one or two? (can’t remember clearly) carriers, it references other ships needing time to come back online but doesn’t go into details, it doesn’t state anywhere that the Connie has been taken offline so I would imagine it would still be on patrol, maybe with a reduced crew?
 
Fleet Action references that Kruger took his Confed Destroyer (which is now the Flagship of the FRL fleet in Fleet Action) with him, when he disobeyed Confed orders to stay behind and defend the systems of the republic during the early years of the war.

I'm not sure if that's the same ship. I think Action Stations references his destroyer as being destroyed, and I believe Fleet Action even mentions it being shot out from under him, but that's a question you should direct toward LOAF. If I understand correctly, Action Stations is a sort of historical fiction look at the start of the war, and thus, not necessarily entirely accurate.

In false Colours, Landreich also acquires wartime Kilrathi Bhantkara class heavy carrier which they repair and put into service, along with various kilrathi fighters which were part of the Bhantkara’s complement, they also seize a Kilrathi picket ship in the book, but it doesn’t go into detail in about its fate.

False Colors also reveals some other interesting tidbits:

-The FRLN has at least one tender (Sindri) that can provide support to a ship that's been damaged or is in need of repair in deep space, without a dock.

-The FRLN also has a factory ship that can manufacture goods from raw materials.

-The FRLN attempted (at one point) to develop it's own carrier by converting a large freighter with the installation of a flight deck, but the design was scrapped because it was to limited.

-Following the Battle of Terra at least a token force of Confederation capital ships were stationed defensively at Landreich. What relationship they had with the FRLN is not clear, but presumably (as stated above) the 'loaned' ships from FA (which was really just a confederation ruse) were returned to the Confederation, leaving the FRLN somewhat naked in terms of a traditional battle fleet.

-False Colors also establishes that as of FC, the FRLN Flagship was a carrier (Independence?) that Kruger had re-outfitted with special VIP quarters.

-There appears to be a shortage of fighters in the FRLN, based on the fact that a number of carriers in the book are either short or without fighters for some good portions of the book. We're never given definitive numbers or facts on this, but at one point Kruger sails a CVE into battle with less then a squadron of fighters on board.
 
I have to confess, I have only read Action Stations once :) I am at work so i can't check any of the books :(

I forgot about the Sindrii, although it gets potted in the book.

I thought the freighter/carrier conversion was a Mercenary ship??

As Jason_Ryock says, there were at least two Confed Cruisers patrolling Landreich (that is how the Bhantkara ended up derelict in Landreich space.), its implied in the monologue of the captains thoughts that this was a quid pro quo for Krugers actions at the Battle of Earth in Fleet Action, so I don't know if you would count these as part of Landreich's fleet as they are still Confed ships
 
I thought the freighter/carrier conversion was a Mercenary ship??

It is a Mercenary Ship, however, the original design and concept was for a Landreich carrier.

As Jason_Ryock says, there were at least two Confed Cruisers patrolling Landreich (that is how the Bhantkara ended up derelict in Landreich space.), its implied in the monologue of the captains thoughts that this was a quid pro quo for Krugers actions at the Battle of Earth in Fleet Action, so I don't know if you would count these as part of Landreich's fleet as they are still Confed ships

Well here's the thing. Kruger isn't likely to like - or even want - the Confed to patrol his borders. So if he's insisting they come help him out after the battle of terra I think it's safe to infer that his fleet without the CVE's has been throughly gutted. The fact that he accepts and allows a pair of Confederation ships to defend his planets suggests to me that his fleet (the CVE's none with standing) must have taken some hefty damage during the two battles they participated in (the attack on Landreich before the battle of Terra, and their rush to the defense of Earth during the battle of Terra).

While we're not given any of the details aside from the fact that there was only a chance to launch one missile salvo at earth, there was still a Kilrathi fleet in orbit that had to be decimated by the Landreich Forces when they arrived.
 
I was just wondering if we ever had a full spectrum of the size of their fleet. I know the Free Republic got the Tarawa and a number of other CVEs and perhaps some cruisers and destroyers, but was that it? Did they ever develop their own design of ships?

The FRLN doesn't come into its own until after the war. All of the earlier battles (the initial Kilrathi invasion, Hell Hole, Second Hell Hole) are fought by the occasional capital ship and fleets of spit-and-glue privateers and freighters.

The idea in False Colors is that Kruger has made building a proper Navy a priority for the FRL, through ships purchased from the Confederation and refitted.

That fleet is organized around three escort carriers (Arbroath, Magna Carta and Independence), four cruisers (Themistocles, Xenophon and two others) and an unspecified number of destroyers (the cruisers and tin cans are the predominant warships in the Landreich, according to Richards--named destroyers include Durendal and Caliburn... Kruger also had a destroyed named Blitzkreig in Fleet Action, it's unclear what became of it).

(And of course there's also the Mjollnir, the salvaged Bhantkara that the book is about).

Also, I'm still waiting to get my hands on Fleet Action... was the Concordia taken off line during the armistice? If so, why didn't Landriech try to purchase her?

The Confederation didn't put FOR SALE signs on all their warships; rather, there was a particular plan developed to provide the Landreich with particular weapons and personnel needed to penetrate the lines and search for the Kilrathi fleet. Remember, Tolwyn was *intentionally* disgraced so he could lead this effort. There's another layer of intrigue here that everyone is still missing, though.

The five CVEs were technically sold to a private contractor for reconfiguring as civilian transports (Tolwyn specifies this when he is explaining the plan to Bear and company); this had the base appearance of being above board since the CVEs began their lives as heavy transports... not so much the Confederation's most powerful dreadnaught (and, of course, the military had a strong idea of what was going on--they weren't about to sell off their precious fleet carriers even if they had that ability).

(The pilots and crews were technically the 'Free Corps', a group of Confederation volunteers.)

Note that the surviving CVEs *were* returned to the Confederation (other carriers, given to the Border Worlds were not).

As for her status: two carriers were kept active and two were dry-docked with a thirty day prep time and the rest had their reactors pulled. Concordia would have fallen into one of the first two categories, but it isn't clear which.

I'm not sure if that's the same ship. I think Action Stations references his destroyer as being destroyed, and I believe Fleet Action even mentions it being shot out from under him, but that's a question you should direct toward LOAF.

The destroyer was destroyed (it's not the Blitzkreig, his flag in Fleet Action... it was the TCS San Jacinto) -- but there's two incidents that are similar, which confuses people. It's actually cleared up towards the start of False Colors (when Bear reads about the history of the Landreich).

In 2634, the Landreich is still part of the Confederation. The Kilrathi send one prong of their initial invasion fleet to the region. President Bulcher organizes a makeshift fleet to defend the region, the Confederation being unable to spare forces to counter a Kilrathi diversion. Newly-comisioned Lieutenant Commander Kruger is given a 'frigate' (described as being 'actually an aging transport with guns welded on') for that action. The Landreichers suffer heavy losses and their outer worlds are smashed... but the Kilrathi are driven off, losing three cruisers and suffering a battleship disabled.

Kruger then takes his frigate two jumps behind enemy lines to raid a Kilrathi base at Fawcett's World, home to an entire division of troops (and a hitherto unknown captured human colony). He brings the frigate into the atmosphere to smash the base but suffers damage and crash lands in the process. He rallies a series of commando raids which ultimately results in the capture of a Kilrathi frigate--which he brings home to Landreich, where he is hailed as a hero.

The confusing thing is: this is *not* the incident spoken of in Fleet Action which involves the stolen ship! That actually comes later.

In 2638, the Kilrathi focused again on the Landreich. The Confederation dispatched a heavy cruiser commanded by Vance Richards to organize the military forces but ultimately ordered him home out of 'strategic necessity'. Kruger, now commanding a destroyer, is part of that squadron -- and part of the mutiny that sends Richards home without his ship. Kruger marshals the Landreich fleet, freighters and smuggler craft, and stops a Kilrathi assault cold in the Battle of the Hell Hole. He then chases the Kilrathi fleet back through twelve jump points until his destroyer is lost in an ambush.

... but he and his surviving crew escape to the Kilrathi that has been coordinating the efforts in the sector, where they conduct commando raids for three years This actually stops the Kilrathi interest in the Landreich. He's rescued *three years* later by a feelancer (so, ~2641) and returned to the Landreich. He learns that the Confederation has tried him in absentia and convicted him of capital crimes (mutiny, hijacking of a warship). He's the greatest hero the Landreich has ever seen, though, and they elect him system President within the year--making him a member of the Senate and theoretically immune to arrest and trial.

Several years later, in 2650, the Confederation finally ordered his arrest... which prompted a bloodless coup: the expulsion of the sector's governor, a declaration of independence and the election of Kruger to lead the new Republic. The Confederation accepted the declaration, unable or unwilling to fight a war to hold the Landreich in the heyday of the Vega Campaign.

If I understand correctly, Action Stations is a sort of historical fiction look at the start of the war, and thus, not necessarily entirely accurate.

Not exactly. The idea is that it's a "book in a book"--you're reading Action Stations, which is in the Wing Commander universe a novel by Colonel Schwarzmont. But it isn't historical fiction, it's a properly researched book. Schwarzmont has also written the comprehensive military history of those campaigns, and Action Stations is the 'popular' version; think of it as being along the lines of 'Band of Brothers'--proper history by a historian but in a populist narrative format.

-The FRLN attempted (at one point) to develop it's own carrier by converting a large freighter with the installation of a flight deck, but the design was scrapped because it was to limited.

The interesting thing about this one is that it happened *many* years before the rest of this, in 2661... well before the Landreich seems to have a proper navy.

I thought the freighter/carrier conversion was a Mercenary ship??

It was developed by the Landreich, the idea was scrapped and the prototype was purchased by Zachary Banfield's Guild.

Well here's the thing. Kruger isn't likely to like - or even want - the Confed to patrol his borders. So if he's insisting they come help him out after the battle of terra I think it's safe to infer that his fleet without the CVE's has been throughly gutted. The fact that he accepts and allows a pair of Confederation ships to defend his planets suggests to me that his fleet (the CVE's none with standing) must have taken some hefty damage during the two battles they participated in (the attack on Landreich before the battle of Terra, and their rush to the defense of Earth during the battle of Terra).

I don't think he had any sort of organized fleet at all at this point. False Colors mentions that a 'handful of ships' were stationed in the Landreich but also that the Confederation government was *extremely* eager to please Kruger because of his role in saving Earth, which is why so many Confederation ships were dispatched to help stop the Kilrathi vengeance raid at the end of the war.
 
* ahh, Ninja'd by LOAF,

He has explained it far better than I can.


While we're not given any of the details aside from the fact that there was only a chance to launch one missile salvo at earth, there was still a Kilrathi fleet in orbit that had to be decimated by the Landreich Forces when they arrived.

I think it was a cruiser squadron that broke through the defending fleet to strike earth

There was time for more than one salvo, however, the Kilrathi cruisers (Well the crucial one cruiser anyway) didn't get the chance to launch anything other than the initial Anti-Matter strike for reasons other than Kruger and the Landreich arriving, (Can't go into details because it'll be a spoiler if the OP hasn't read Fleet Action)

Likewise, enough of the Kilrathi Fleet was destroyed by other means than ship to ship combat to force it to withdraw, I got the impression that the unusual tactics by the Marines destroying Kilrathi ships, plus the arrival of Krugers Fleet that drove the Kilrathi off rather than decimating them, although numerous ships were destroyed including three of the "Big" ones (how do spoiler tags work again?) with both the other "Big" ones damaged. I never got the impression Krugers fleet engaged anything other than the cruiser squadron (and even then it seemed to be the fighters off the CVE's mainly), and that their presense was enough to make the Kilrathi think twice bearing in mind the losses they had just sustained
 
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