Kilrathi War.

And a little thing called the Nuremburg trials said that even if your CO is pointing a gun at you, you cannot commit a crime against humanity, you are supposed to die. Any race or group of people that commits a henous act like the T-Bomb run on kilrah, or any of the attacks the cats made using bio weapons, does not derserve to survive. If i had to choose between sacraficing my humanity and surviving or keeping my honor and humanity, i would choose keeping my honor and humanity.
 
Dont bring that, the britts had level hamburg and they did target the civilian population on purpose.
Also in End Run they were ordered to not bomb Kilrah and they had the chance.
 
Kilrah was a military target, not an attrocity -- civilians were killed, but it was *not* attacked for the sake of slaughtering civilians, rather for a specific strategic gain.

In End Run they were ordered not to bomb Kilrah because of the reprecussions politically, *not* because it was a war crime.
 
Napoleon, the hours before the T-Bomb run on Kilrah was humanity's finest hour...
A choice had to be made: saving humanity by destroying the homeplanet of the Kilrathi, a race of bloodthirsty aliens that before that moment had demonstrated no humanity or feeling of the kind whatsoever, or being utterly destroyed by that alien race...

In one hand: save ourselves, defeat the bad guys, even if it means detroying millions of lives.

In the other hand: do nothing, let the alien race strike Terra and exterminate us, thereby allowing the destruction of BILLIONS of lives (Terra + all other Terran colonies... adds up to pretty much a LOT of people...)

The choice, if there was any, doesn't seem too hard to me...
 
Originally posted by Iceberg
There is no canon evidence to support the the supposition that Confed committed war atrocities as a matter of government policy (are you playing a different series of games than I am??). When during the war did Confed commit atrocities on its own civilians?
Does the name Dr. Severin ring a bell?

If the survival of my entire species were on the line and I could make a difference, you can bet I'd fight. Sure, the human species has a lot of potential for evil, but it also has a lot of potential for good, and that doesn't deserve to get wiped out.
And... that... is... precisely what I'm saying about the Kilrathi. Humans have as much potential for evil as the Kilrathi, and the Kilrathi have as much potential of good as humans. Why you keep bringing up Kilrathi attrocities, as if this proves anything? What about Hitler's attrocities... or indeed, what about Tolwyn's attrocities? These may not be "Confed" and not war-time, but they still prove that humans can be just as evil as the Kilrathi. Ergo, if you're going to argue that the Kilrathi are pure evil, then you have to say the same about humans, just to be consistent.
 
Originally posted by Dragon
I belive that Quarto is not praising the good of the war time Kilrahi political system and society, he is just saying that Kilrathi and Humans are similar races, both capable of good and of evil.
After the war was over (most of) the Kilrathi live in peace with the other races.

Because the Kilrathi were utterly defeated and their ability to make war was completely annihilated.

In Wing Commander Prophecy, Kilrathi raiders - remnants of their old military forces - are back up to their old tricks. Doesn't sound too peaceable to me.
 
Originally posted by Iceberg
In Wing Commander Prophecy, Kilrathi raiders - remnants of their old military forces - are back up to their old tricks. Doesn't sound too peaceable to me.
In Wing Commander Privateer, pirates are back to their old tricks. Doesn't sound too peaceable to me.
What's the difference? I fail to see it.
 
Quarto: Granted, in this particular case there are none.

I wonder though if those Kilrathi raiders were just "raiding" the ships, leaving the crew alive, or if they were also celebrating their "raid" with some fireworks coming from the "raided" ship...
 
Do you think that human pirates leave the Crews alive or let then return to tell who did steal their cargo?
Were do you think that slaves are coming from.
 
Hey, I said "leaving the crew alive", which includes enslavement Dragon...
Did the Kilrathi "enslave" or "wipe out", mmmh??
 
Originally posted by Quarto
Originally posted by Iceberg
There is no canon evidence to support the the supposition that Confed committed war atrocities as a matter of government policy (are you playing a different series of games than I am??). When during the war did Confed commit atrocities on its own civilians?
Does the name Dr. Severin ring a bell?

Dr. Severin's experiments and opinions do NOT represent Confed as a whole.

If the survival of my entire species were on the line and I could make a difference, you can bet I'd fight. Sure, the human species has a lot of potential for evil, but it also has a lot of potential for good, and that doesn't deserve to get wiped out.
And... that... is... precisely what I'm saying about the Kilrathi. Humans have as much potential for evil as the Kilrathi, and the Kilrathi have as much potential of good as humans. Why you keep bringing up Kilrathi attrocities, as if this proves anything? What about Hitler's attrocities... or indeed, what about Tolwyn's attrocities? These may not be "Confed" and not war-time, but they still prove that humans can be just as evil as the Kilrathi. Ergo, if you're going to argue that the Kilrathi are pure evil, then you have to say the same about humans, just to be consistent.

The Kilrathi are not pure evil. The Kilrathi GOVERNMENT is evil: it follows policies of aggression, enslavement and genocide against alien races.
 
Originally posted by Quarto
Originally posted by Iceberg
In Wing Commander Prophecy, Kilrathi raiders - remnants of their old military forces - are back up to their old tricks. Doesn't sound too peaceable to me.
In Wing Commander Privateer, pirates are back to their old tricks. Doesn't sound too peaceable to me.
What's the difference? I fail to see it.

The difference between the Terran Confederation and the Empire of Kilrah is that the Terran government does not, nor did it during the Kilrathi War, pursue an aggressively xenophobic policy of enslavement, conquest and genocide. The Kilrathi government did.
 
Originally posted by mpanty
Hey, I said "leaving the crew alive", which includes enslavement Dragon...
Did the Kilrathi "enslave" or "wipe out", mmmh??

The same as human pirates, it will depend if they need slaves or not, Kilrathi raiders do keep slaves, read WC P manual, its there.
 
Originally posted by Dragon
Humans pirates = Kilrathi raiders.

rememeber all those slaves to buy on pirate bases in Privateer?

Yep.

I eventually started leaving the ejected crew members behind because it got me in less trouble than hauling their stupid asses back to starbase and selling them.
 
I don't understand what's so hard to understand about this:

The Kilrathi government was led by a power-mad dictator.

The Confed government was not.

The Kilrathi government attacked first.

Confed did not.

The Kilrathi government spent five years preying on Terran shipping.

Confed did not.

The Kilrathi government attacked the Confederation without provocation.

The Kilrathi government used biological weapons on the Confederation.

The Kilrathi government made an armistice with the purpose of deceiving the Confederation into lowering its guard so they could annihilate the entire human race.

The Kilrathi government was preparing to launch a full-scale assault into the heart of Terran space, armed with biological weapons similar to the type used against Locanda IV.

The Kilrathi government's foreign policy was ALWAYS to enslave or destroy all other species of sentient life in the universe.

Therefore, the Kilrathi government was EVIL.
 
I would just like to add, that if confed did not T-Bomb kilrah, it would not have been a definite matter that earth would be destroyed, yes in all likely hood that is what would have happend, but before the battle of Vulkar Tag it was almost definite that confed was going to loose the war, after mcalliuf it was almost definite that confed was finished, Hunter and Paladin and K'Kia and Gwen Larson, and Kirha were almost definitely going to fail, Confed was almost definitely going to loose in the BoT. If you get my point that nothing is certain, it only has a high probablility, it is your choice whether or not to definitely sacrafice the lives of and entire planet's population, or to most probably loose your own home planet. I personally probably would have used the T-Bomb, but that by no means would have made it right. I would have droped the T-Bomb, but I considering that I just condemed 30 billion people to their deaths, I would have stayed in the blast radius of kilrah.
 
Originally posted by Napoleon
I would just like to add, that if confed did not T-Bomb kilrah, it would not have been a definite matter that earth would be destroyed, yes in all likely hood that is what would have happend, but before the battle of Vulkar Tag it was almost definite that confed was going to loose the war, after mcalliuf it was almost definite that confed was finished, Hunter and Paladin and K'Kia and Gwen Larson, and Kirha were almost definitely going to fail, Confed was almost definitely going to loose in the BoT. If you get my point that nothing is certain, it only has a high probablility, it is your choice whether or not to definitely sacrafice the lives of and entire planet's population, or to most probably loose your own home planet. I personally probably would have used the T-Bomb, but that by no means would have made it right. I would have droped the T-Bomb, but I considering that I just condemed 30 billion people to their deaths, I would have stayed in the blast radius of kilrah.

We are actually rather fortunate as far as sci-fi goes. Because Wing Commander is a video game with multiple paths and multiple endgames, we have canon footage showing what would happen in the event of a Terran loss of the war, and it IS the utter destruction of the planet Earth. Not in as literal of terms as the destruction of Kilrah, but the Kilrathi utterly destroy humanity in the losing endgame of Wing Commander.

The losing endgame of each of the games isn't *part of the timeline,* but because it's a filmed part of the game, it retains canon status. It's what WOULD (not might) have happened had you not succeeded.
 
I belive that this is about if the race is capable of doing good or it just evil, not the form of goverment (in that all forms are evil [ex.taxes]).
 
Originally posted by Dragon
I belive that this is about if the race is capable of doing good or it just evil, not the form of goverment (in that all forms are evil [ex.taxes]).

We very seldom deal with anything of the Kilrathi outside of their government. The Kilrathi government is xenophobic, and follows a wholly evil foreign policy. It's good and just to oppose such a government.

In Wing Commander, you are not waging war against the Kilrathi people in general - you are waging war against the Kilrathi Empire - the government and military forces of the Kilrathi.
 
Back
Top