Elder Scrolls IV: Oblivion Discussion Thread

meisdavidp

All your belief cannot absolve your sin.
They did actually come out and say in a few forums that they were going to charge less for the next one in response to some of the criticism, you're right that they were planned and put together arouond the same time though. I found it in the official forums, posted by one of the devs. The odd part about that was he also said the horse mod sold better than they expected. So much for the market fixing it, eh? I actually somewhat think this system has potential. I tend to advocate for online distribution as long as it's secure. Just hope these next mods are better in terms of content.
 

PeteyG

I can have an avatar now
Yeah, the upcoming mods were definitely not conceived and developed in response to the horse skin controversy. But there's clearly a response to the community backlash, which was my point.

I kind of wonder about their reports of how well the horse mod is selling. "Better than expected" can mean a lot of things; I personally wouldn't expect $2 horse skins to sell all that many units... so if it sold more than a few, I would be able to classify it as being 'more than expected'. I can also see how they would not want to come out and say "yeah, this mod isn't doing as well as we hoped.", from a marketing standpoint. I'd be interested in seeing some hard numbers, though.

Quarto said:
(also, I don't think you can really say the uproar was that huge... really, the fans complained about this about as much as they did about the lack of crossbows and half a million other issues, real or imaginary)
There's certainly been bigger... but the story has gotten pretty wide coverage Internet-wise. It's also a hot topic of discussion in my local Oblivion-Anonymous group.
 

meisdavidp

All your belief cannot absolve your sin.
the fact of it all is, the internet is very misleading sometimes. Just because internet junkies are all over this story doesn't mean the rest of the world has even noticed. People tend not to talk about things that work perfectly for them, which means that any piece of software or software modification that's released is likely to hear a lot more criticism than praise. Everyone else tends to be off playing it. People really have a way of inflating their own significance. A lot of the complaints about the game's bugginess (while very valid in their need to be resolved) accuse bethesda of releasing a very buggy game while that can't be the case. When I start seeing major publications adding even a simple endnote about its "wide-spread problems" to their reviews of the game (aside from the ones that warn readers that low end systems will have problems, that one's a given) then I'll change my view on this. I have CTDs from time to time, but I realize that the game's been out for about a month now. Simply put, people need to chill the [flip] out.

Also, the reason the internet loves to hate the horse mod is because it's a very simple thing to make fun of. That said, I won't be purchasing the horse mod until I can add spinners to it. Then I'ma ride that thang through the entire game and show off to all those adoring (and often oblivious) NPCs. W00T. Gonna mod it to have Chuck Norris' face and do the numa numa dance or chant all your base are belong to Dave. Or maybe just hope all this craziness calms down.

edit: Some people ARE VERY VOCAL about things that work for them. Hell, they're not even always fanboys. My point was that the average person with no problems isn't nearly as likely to pop up and announce his opinion.
 

Lt.Death100

Spaceman
meisdavidp said:
the fact of it all is, the internet is very misleading sometimes. Just because internet junkies are all over this story doesn't mean the rest of the world has even noticed. People tend not to talk about things that work perfectly for them, which means that any piece of software or software modification that's released is likely to hear a lot more criticism than praise. Everyone else tends to be off playing it. People really have a way of inflating their own significance. A lot of the complaints about the game's bugginess (while very valid in their need to be resolved) accuse bethesda of releasing a very buggy game while that can't be the case. When I start seeing major publications adding even a simple endnote about its "wide-spread problems" to their reviews of the game (aside from the ones that warn readers that low end systems will have problems, that one's a given) then I'll change my view on this. I have CTDs from time to time, but I realize that the game's been out for about a month now. Simply put, people need to chill the [flip] out.

Also, the reason the internet loves to hate the horse mod is because it's a very simple thing to make fun of. That said, I won't be purchasing the horse mod until I can add spinners to it. Then I'ma ride that thang through the entire game and show off to all those adoring (and often oblivious) NPCs. W00T. Gonna mod it to have Chuck Norris' face and do the numa numa dance or chant all your base are belong to Dave. Or maybe just hope all this craziness calms down.

edit: Some people ARE VERY VOCAL about things that work for them. Hell, they're not even always fanboys. My point was that the average person with no problems isn't nearly as likely to pop up and announce his opinion.
Very true. You can't just assume that everybody talking about it is everybody playing it.
 

Haesslich

Spaceman
Incidentally, the INI fixes didn't help at all - I don't even get to the intro screens before it crashes. Maybe I'll just try another PC...

And for the record, it's an A64 3000+ with 1GB PC3200 RAM and an old ATi x1300Pro. Yeah, I'm cheap. :p
 

meisdavidp

All your belief cannot absolve your sin.
Haesslich, that setup's about equal to/better than mine, man. I'm not sure what your comp's problem is... Probably don't even need to say it, but how recently have you defrag'd? Come to think of it, you mentioned earlier that you suspected a hardware problem. Have you installed/reinstalled the latest catalyst drivers? Make sure to use the catalyst unintaller program before doing so.
 

Haesslich

Spaceman
I've reinstalled the latest CAtalyst Drivers, used Driver Cleaner Pro after uninstalling before reinstalling. I uninstalled the game, defragged the hard drive, then reinstalled the game too. It doesn't even get to the intro... or anything close to that. It just crashes out right away... and I'm not sure why. I'll be swapping some hardware around and seeing if that fixes it.

And Ed, yes, that's a new card. A low-end card, but a new one.
 

meisdavidp

All your belief cannot absolve your sin.
I'm not sure what the problem could be, but I hope you can get it fixed, the game really is quite good.
 

meisdavidp

All your belief cannot absolve your sin.
The Dark Brotherhood missions seem pretty awesome to me. First bloody mission you have to infiltrate a pirate ship and kill the captain. Don't know about everyone else here, but I loved the mission impossible-style dynamic of missions like that. I seriously only was detected by/killed the captain despite numerous close calls.
 

Lt.Death100

Spaceman
meisdavidp said:
The Dark Brotherhood missions seem pretty awesome to me. First bloody mission you have to infiltrate a pirate ship and kill the captain. Don't know about everyone else here, but I loved the mission impossible-style dynamic of missions like that. I seriously only was detected by/killed the captain despite numerous close calls.
I personally like the party quest.:)
 

meisdavidp

All your belief cannot absolve your sin.
Haven't gotten to that one, but I've heard about it, sounds like fun. I'm playing a different character than the one I had in that guild. Not really sure what this new guy's up to, but he's much better with a bow than any of my previous alter egos (which could of course lend itself to dark brotherhood types of killing. We shall see).

BTW: I'm looking at getting for my new video card an nvideo 7600GTX, has anyone heard anything about that card either being particularly good or bad for Oblivion?
 

QuailPilot

Spaceman
moonshadow helps a lot in the pirate captain mission.

Dark Brotherhood is great, but the thing about Morag Tong was that it was government approved assainations. (The Honorable Writs)
 

BrynS

Mr Kat says...
meisdavidp said:
...BTW: I'm looking at getting for my new video card an nvideo 7600GTX, has anyone heard anything about that card either being particularly good or bad for Oblivion?
I assume you mean the 7600GT and not the 7900GTX?

The 7600GT is a very competent performer and probably the choice, mid-range video card available at the moment. Firingsquad have run a number of Oblivion benchmarks recently and the 7600GT puts in a strong showing. However, ATI's X1K series, particularly the X1800 and X1900 variants are providing better and more consistent (smoother and smaller dips between min and max fps) performance in Oblivion, while also being the only cards capable of enabling both anti-aliasing (MSAA) and high-dynamic range (HDR) concurrently on the PC version.

I would advise against the X1600 Pro/XT as they are underpowered in texturing capability, but there are some good deals going on X1800GTO's (some, possibly all, of which can potentially be flashed to X1800XL's) and the X1800XT 256MB, both of which have a better featureset and will allow for HDR+AA in Oblivion, if optimal image quality is an important driver in your decision. Either way, the 7600GT offers a very playable Oblivion experience and is an excellent all-round solution.

As for the game itself, while I am currently taking a break from Tamriel, I've found the experience largely engrossing and at times, surprisingly sophisticated. The world is beautifully realised and populated to an almost dangerous level for those with an obsessive tendency to fully explore every abandonded fort, ruin, cave, climb every mountain, etc. :D So far, I've avoided the main quest and have just been travelling from town to town, exploring the wilderness along the way and doing side quests. I'm looking forward to doing the Dark Brotherhood and Thieve's Guild quests, which seem to be drawing alot of praise.

While impressive at times, I've found the RadiantAI system a bit of a letdown after all the hype and dynamic E3 videos, which now look heavily scripted in comparison with the typical experience. Other minor gripes are the limited dialogue at times and often inconsistent voice acting and quality, with the same character sometimes eliciting different voices mid-dialogue regardess of disposition and speechcraft.

The somewhat contentious levelling system has been noticeable at times too. While it hasn't been a constant irratation with my second character, a Redguard warrior (level 14), it suddenly caught up with my first one, a Breton Mage, which I found drastically underpowered once I hit level 7 -- there were some pretty funny remarks on the official forums about the auto-levelling system -- I'll see if I can dig one up. The interface was obviously designed for the XBOX360 -- luckily, the excellent BTMod improves significantly on the original and the myriad other mods already released or in the works will add to the experience greatly.

Cheers,


BrynS
 

BrynS

Mr Kat says...
Hmm, here's one of the remarks made at the official forums reflecting the frustration felt by some with the levelling system -- the original thread appears to be dead/deleted.

Uranium - 235 @ Official Elderscrolls Forum said:
GM: "Okay you guys have decided to take the left branch. After travelling for about a mile, PC1, you get a feeling of dread, and then an arrow zips inches past your face and buries itself in the trees next to you."

PC2: "Bandits!"

PC1: "Oh for crying out loud."

GM: "You turn and see four bandits, one looks to be a mage, one an archer, and two with swords."

PC1: "I take my Holy Avenger off my back and wave it at them."

PC2: "I tell them to not come any closer and that if they run home to mommy I won't go all 'Wail of the Banshee' on them."

GM: "The bandit who looks like the leader takes his Vorpal Sword off his back and calls back '100 gold or your life!'"

PC1: "Vorpal Sword?"

PC2: "100 gold?"

GM: "What do you do?"

PC2: "What's he wearing?"

GM: "Let's see... you pass your Lore check, you identify his armor as what seems to be Full Plate of Storm Giant Strength +4"

PC2: "Are you JOKING?"

GM: "No, why?"

PC1: "These are BANDITS. These guys are no different then f****** MUGGERS. The only reason they're out HERE is because the guards chased them out of the last town. They're criminals, they're poor, they're desperate and they're stupid."

GM: "The bandit mage begins to cast Imprison on you."

PC1: "This is ******* stupid."

GM: "My game my rules."
:p
 

Fatcat

Swabbie
Banned
The somewhat contentious levelling system has been noticeable at times too. While it hasn't been a constant irratation with my second character, a Redguard warrior (level 14), it suddenly caught up with my first one, a Breton Mage, which I found drastically underpowered once I hit level 7...
I'm interested. Underpowered in which way? It should be very, very hard to back you character into a dead-end.
Could someone link me to these people complaining about Oblivion's leveling system? I'm interested in hearing their arguments. Oblivion, Morrowind, and Daggerfall all had very similar leveling systems, which so far have been far better than anything else devised. I'd rather not go back to "killing a troll makes me better at lockpicking and I can increase my magic by stabbing goblins all day".
 

meisdavidp

All your belief cannot absolve your sin.
BrynS said:
I assume you mean the 7600GT and not the 7900GTX?

The 7600GT is a very competent performer and probably the choice, mid-range video card available at the moment. Firingsquad have run a number of Oblivion benchmarks recently and the 7600GT puts in a strong showing. However, ATI's X1K series, particularly the X1800 and X1900 variants are providing better and more consistent (smoother and smaller dips between min and max fps) performance in Oblivion, while also being the only cards capable of enabling both anti-aliasing (MSAA) and high-dynamic range (HDR) concurrently on the PC version.

I would advise against the X1600 Pro/XT as they are underpowered in texturing capability, but there are some good deals going on X1800GTO's (some, possibly all, of which can potentially be flashed to X1800XL's) and the X1800XT 256MB, both of which have a better featureset and will allow for HDR+AA in Oblivion, if optimal image quality is an important driver in your decision. Either way, the 7600GT offers a very playable Oblivion experience and is an excellent all-round solution.
I appreciate the info, however, I am avoid ATI cards at the moment. I despise the kinds of nonsense they use with their Catalyst packages and I play a lot of games designed for Nvidia. I'm pretty much decided on the GeForce 7600GT and was simply seeing if anyone had heard any specific problems with it. Thanks for the info, though.
 
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