OriginalPhoenix
Professor Emeritus
Except that "God, himself" in this case had absolutely nothing to do with WCP, and therefore wouldn't know.
Classification of TCS Eisen
- Thread starter Dragonslayer
- Start date
WildWeasel
Spaceman
Ok...
Cruiser - General cap-ship. Sometimes carries fighters for support. Usually has low to average pilot and equipment quality due to the low priority.
Quick-Strike Cruiser - Specialist cap-ship designed to get a priority job done in a hurry. Generally assigned the best pilots and equipment due to the high-value nature of missions for this ship.
Escort Carrier - Tiny pure carrier. Only carries a single squadron of fighters (or less). Assigned to areas that need a minimal fighter presence but have a very, very low risk factor. If it sees anything heavier than the lightest combat, its almost guaranteed dead. Also occasionally assigned by Confed to suicide missions behind enemy lines where the loss of the carrier is all but guaranteed. Assigning anything but average pilots and equipment is a waste of resources. Low end of the totem pole for upgrades due to high attrition factor in combat.
Carrier - Capable of carrying out a wide array of activities, including independent operations and task force support. Generally assigned average equipment due to generalist nature, though pilot quality can vary widely from carrier to carrier.
Fleet Carrier - The centerpiece of the fleet. Huge squadrons. Rarely found without a full group of escorts. Anything other than high value, heavily defended targets, is a waste of resources for these carriers, and as a result, they generally have the highest quality pilots and equipment. Admirals often roost in these, and make certain that their ships get the best of everything.
Midway class - A large, fully carrier, fully capable of independent operations with minimal support. Intelligence assets include a fully staffed science team. Contains the resources necessary to sift through data and uncover targets with little direction from high command (which is the primary difference between a Midway and the typical CVS). Also capable of adapting standard munitions to use new warheads/ technologies/ etc... The ONLY things capable of interfering with the operations of a Midway class are damage to the carrier itself (particularly destruction of the carrier) and pilot attrition. Even with minimal pre-mission intelligence, a Midway class carrier is fully capable of making a major nuisance if left unchecked. Due to the unsupported nature of its missions, Midway class carriers are typically provided the highest quality pilots and equipment. Estimates indicate a high probability that Midway class carriers and Hades class Quick Strike Cruisers will be found operating in tandem once both classes are fully operational.
Cruiser - General cap-ship. Sometimes carries fighters for support. Usually has low to average pilot and equipment quality due to the low priority.
Quick-Strike Cruiser - Specialist cap-ship designed to get a priority job done in a hurry. Generally assigned the best pilots and equipment due to the high-value nature of missions for this ship.
Escort Carrier - Tiny pure carrier. Only carries a single squadron of fighters (or less). Assigned to areas that need a minimal fighter presence but have a very, very low risk factor. If it sees anything heavier than the lightest combat, its almost guaranteed dead. Also occasionally assigned by Confed to suicide missions behind enemy lines where the loss of the carrier is all but guaranteed. Assigning anything but average pilots and equipment is a waste of resources. Low end of the totem pole for upgrades due to high attrition factor in combat.
Carrier - Capable of carrying out a wide array of activities, including independent operations and task force support. Generally assigned average equipment due to generalist nature, though pilot quality can vary widely from carrier to carrier.
Fleet Carrier - The centerpiece of the fleet. Huge squadrons. Rarely found without a full group of escorts. Anything other than high value, heavily defended targets, is a waste of resources for these carriers, and as a result, they generally have the highest quality pilots and equipment. Admirals often roost in these, and make certain that their ships get the best of everything.
Midway class - A large, fully carrier, fully capable of independent operations with minimal support. Intelligence assets include a fully staffed science team. Contains the resources necessary to sift through data and uncover targets with little direction from high command (which is the primary difference between a Midway and the typical CVS). Also capable of adapting standard munitions to use new warheads/ technologies/ etc... The ONLY things capable of interfering with the operations of a Midway class are damage to the carrier itself (particularly destruction of the carrier) and pilot attrition. Even with minimal pre-mission intelligence, a Midway class carrier is fully capable of making a major nuisance if left unchecked. Due to the unsupported nature of its missions, Midway class carriers are typically provided the highest quality pilots and equipment. Estimates indicate a high probability that Midway class carriers and Hades class Quick Strike Cruisers will be found operating in tandem once both classes are fully operational.
Bandit LOAF
Long Live the Confederation!
Escort carriers have several squadrons -- the Tarawa-type carried three... compared to the 4-5 of a light carrier, 8-10 of a medium carrier or 16-40 of a heavy carrier.
I suppose it would depend on the carrier. The Tarawa was basically a converted freighter, and was built with the Kilrah suicide attack in mind (where the extra fighters would come in handy). IMHO, a full three squadrons of fighters on an escort carrier built for low threat operations would be something of a waste. If multiple fighter types are needed in that environment, a few partial squadrons would be a lot more useful (i.e. half-size or quarter-size squadrons of different fighter types).
However, since the only CVE I'm aware of that we've got a compliment number for is the Tarawa, I'm not about to argue the numbers.
However, since the only CVE I'm aware of that we've got a compliment number for is the Tarawa, I'm not about to argue the numbers.
t.c.cgi
Vice Admiral
Even in low threat situations a single squadron would be stretched to run the long rang patrols on shifts. In order to keep gaps low, 3 squadrons are probably assigned to each CVE. And I doubt the old conversion type CVE's are still in service, probably replaced by this new Eagle class everyone is talking about heh.
The Marines made a song abour CVE's in WW2, and I think it still fits even in the WC universe...
http://www.gyrene.com/cutsguts.htm
The Marines made a song abour CVE's in WW2, and I think it still fits even in the WC universe...
http://www.gyrene.com/cutsguts.htm
Speaking of WW2, CVEs back then only ran about half a dozen fighters of each type, iirc.
I don't really see why it would be difficult for a dozen fighters to stretch out the patrol allocations. Running them in pairs (which would be standard) would put each pilot in the cockpit for roughly four hours at a stretch, which is hardly unreasonable. Keep another pair on ready status, and you could easily have four fighters out by the time the inbound group arrived, and the rest up shortly thereafter.
Remember that a CVE doesn't get sent into heavy combat zones. Opposition should generally remain light.
And if you still consider that on the light side, add another half a dozen fighters to round it out.
I don't really see why it would be difficult for a dozen fighters to stretch out the patrol allocations. Running them in pairs (which would be standard) would put each pilot in the cockpit for roughly four hours at a stretch, which is hardly unreasonable. Keep another pair on ready status, and you could easily have four fighters out by the time the inbound group arrived, and the rest up shortly thereafter.
Remember that a CVE doesn't get sent into heavy combat zones. Opposition should generally remain light.
And if you still consider that on the light side, add another half a dozen fighters to round it out.
t.c.cgi
Vice Admiral
True, but you've got a lot more area to cover in WC than in WW2. Even with sophisicated sensors and all, considering you'll probably get like one CVE in a system, thats a LOT of area to keep track of. Remember you've got the odd privateer raiding colonies, and not just the human variety.
CVEs probably aren't assigned on a 'per-system' basis. They're navy ships, and designed to go from system to system. If you need an in-system presence, then you build a base, such as Caernavon station. Its cheaper than a ship since it doesn't require engines or jump drives, and can hold as many fighters as you care to add room for.
I envision CVEs being used as an adjunct to a light scout/survey group, or as escorts for convoys going through almost quiet territory. The former adds an extra bit of range and oomph to a group that's really not designed for fire fights, while the latter helps discourage anyone with a couple of light fighters and an assault shuttle from hijacking frieghters. You also might find one providing security on a very low risk VIP mission.
Serious firepower will kill your CVE, but if you're facing that kind of opposition then its time to call in the real warships.
I envision CVEs being used as an adjunct to a light scout/survey group, or as escorts for convoys going through almost quiet territory. The former adds an extra bit of range and oomph to a group that's really not designed for fire fights, while the latter helps discourage anyone with a couple of light fighters and an assault shuttle from hijacking frieghters. You also might find one providing security on a very low risk VIP mission.
Serious firepower will kill your CVE, but if you're facing that kind of opposition then its time to call in the real warships.
I remember hearing about an instance at the battle of Leyte GUlf , when Japanese ships engaged some CVE's inflicting little damage, because the CVE's didn't have enough armor to detonate the incomeing shells.
Interesting note: one of my managers fathers flew off of the USS Santee, the CVE that had the dubious honor, of being the first kamikazee victim.
Interesting note: one of my managers fathers flew off of the USS Santee, the CVE that had the dubious honor, of being the first kamikazee victim.
OriginalPhoenix
Professor Emeritus
They have to have a medium Carrier, or at least a Medium-heavy.
Think about it, if the Midway goes down you lose the space for what, 200 fighters?
What are those pilots going to do, remember in WC4, the Intrepid sneaks up on the Vesuvius using smaller jump points. A Midway can't go everywhere, so you need something between the Hades and Midway, probably another new design.
Think about it, if the Midway goes down you lose the space for what, 200 fighters?
What are those pilots going to do, remember in WC4, the Intrepid sneaks up on the Vesuvius using smaller jump points. A Midway can't go everywhere, so you need something between the Hades and Midway, probably another new design.
Bandit LOAF
Long Live the Confederation!
Newer ships *can* use smaller jump points -- it was a technology that the Kilrathi pioneered at the end of the war and that Confed will certainly have duplicated by the 80s...
Took the words right out of my mouth.
And as far as fighters go...
I'm not sure I understand your point. Yes, if the Midway goes down, there are probably a number of fighters with no place to go. But that tends to happen ANY time that you lose a carrier.
If you lost a Vesuvius, it would be even more fighters.
Stray idea for a custom mission...
One of the enemy CVAs has just been destroyed (combat, accident, doesn't really matter how), but the entire compliment of fighters escaped the destruction. The nearby base was able to take the pilots in, but didn't have room for the fighters. There are now 400+ high-end fighters floating in space, sans pilots, all arranged in nice, neat, rows next to the base, waiting for a pick-up from a retrieval ship. The only active fighter defenses are the squadrons that the base normally carries. How many inactive fighters can you destroy before the defending fighter squadron drives you off? And can you destroy more than anyone else in your flight?
