3rd Oxford Mission

K

Khavik

Spaceman
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Everyone has their piece to say on this mission. I've fun it over three dozen times, now (maybe four -- I've lost count) trying to beat it without cheating. The /closest/ I've come is beating the first wave of five back, and knocking down a few of the second wave of five Demons that come screaming in from nowhere. [Ship: milspec Centurion, max beef, quad plasmas on autotrack gimbals, 40 proton torpedos on autortrack gimbals (which doesn't work, by the way)].

I've experimented. I've watched. I've blown the Drayman I'm supposed to protect up by accident enough times that it's annoying. I've chased Demons. I've sat on the Drayman as a turret. I've used [F5] to track Demons even better as they whiz across my sky. I was determined not to cheat, and knew there /had/ to be a way to beat this mission without buying a Demon of my own.

So when I finally decided, "The hell with it," and chose to cheat, I figured I was going to do it for this one mission. I turned all Draymans into Paradigms, and figured I'd sit back and watch a Paradigm power in for Oxford, turrets blasting anything and everything that fit the description of 'Demon' away. I was vaguely disturbed to watch a Paradigm flip-flop about, trying to perform evasive maneuvers against ships the size of gnats against it, never once firing a shot off. That the Demons destroyed the Paradigm/Drayman is really annoying.

Someone want to beat this level for me? Without cheating, I've amassed half a million credits, and it does me no good. I can't outshoot these Demons. Even plopping a Paradigm in there didn't help. Shoot. Just send me a save-file for the fourth Oxford mission, and I'll take it from there. Anything. Man. What a way to spend a break.

(chuckle) Otherwise, it's an awesome remake. Thanks for some great programming, guys. Just, uh... For those of us that, apparently, aren't Top Guns, could we have a 'beat next mission' button? /I'm/ beat!
 
I managed to beat this mission with a demon with 4 tachyon cannons with autotracking. I had a bank of 10 photon torpedoes and one heat seeking missle. I did not need to use the torpedoes or the missile.

I am sure someone can do this mission with a centaurian but I am not that person, at least not at this time.

It made all the difference in the world to be able to follow the demons out to the end of there little run out and run back. The centaurian just was not fast enough to do that.

dzimmerm
 
Ditto about the demon. I think it's 2x2 gun layout is better than the Cent's 4x1. Your fire is much more concentrated and therefore does way more damage. It's odd that autotracking is not working. What scanner are you using? I've found that autotracking works so much better with the BS Omni vs. anything else, like the Hunter 6i.
 
I was using the B&S Omni for autotracking, but the demons wobble erratically during a good deal of their attack phase -- and home in on the Drayman only at the end of the attack run. With the Centurion, you can't exactly try to follow the Demons out away from the Drayman, so I'm always stuck playing 'turret' to the blasted cargo ferry. It's also an annoyance to try and hunt for the [k] button on the keyboard, because my left hand may be on Home Row, but my right's on the joystick. Wish we could customize the setup, but I can't even get the setup program to run, and acknowledge all the other bells and whistles on my joystick. I'm stubborn. I /will/ beat this mission with a Centurion. Somehow. Hopefully before I get carpal tunnel.

Another attack I make, is when I first arrive, I go screaming in with guns blazing and photon torpedos lighting up Demons from the rear. If I get right in on their arses and unload everything, I tend to take down two or three Demons right from the start. Unfortunately, the remaining Demons behave even more oddly than normal, are harder to track than usual -- but the upside is that they finally all go red!
 
How many demons do you face? I never faced more than 6 - i think it was 3,2,1 as well as a couple of dralthis mucking things up for everyone - but dralthis are way easier to kill than demons =)
 
The Demon needs nerfing (I keep telling but they won't let me... lol).

This said, I think your best bet to beat that mission is with wingmen, in a Galaxy.

Why a Galaxy? Turrets. Hit CTRL+W and your turrets start shooting at the closest enemy target. Plus, if you want to nail someone hit CTRL-T and they will shoot at your target, which considering that you have a top and bottom turret gives you 6 guns to bear instead of 4 on the Cent -- in addition, energy wise you are only paying for 2 of them. I had a Galaxy with tachyon everything and 20 FF and I beat the mission eventually.
 
spiritplumber said:
The Demon needs nerfing (I keep telling but they won't let me... lol).
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The Demons are harmless - just extremely hard to kill ;-)

Their specifications appear to be identical to the original (as listed in the manual).

The problem with the Ox3 mission is that the *strategy* they employ is extremely effective (far more so than the more "direct" and agressive strategy I remember from the orginal).

The one other thing that may be different is the AI's ability to change direction of motion without changing orientation (cf. this thread). That might make them slightly easier to kill, but only when they are not employing the hit-n-run tactic.

And to those who doubt the claim regarding the AI's ability to change direction of motion independent of orientation, go play Ox3 and wait for one of the Demons to circle-strafe the Dray. Circle-strafing = Moving in a circle around a target while continually facing (and firing upon) that target. Easily doable (in 2D) in games like Quake, but not possible for the *player* in P:R.
 
olDirtyMin said:
How many demons do you face? I never faced more than 6 - i think it was 3,2,1 as well as a couple of dralthis mucking things up for everyone - but dralthis are way easier to kill than demons =)
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It should take two missiles to pop a demon. With 20 missiles you ought to be able to pop ten demons.

Have they upgraded the lethalness of the missiles?
 
Two missiles only kill a Demon if they hit exactly right. The Demons twist and turn so much that often two missiles don't hit the same spot and a Demon and as a result only damage it.
 
JKeefe said:
Two missiles only kill a Demon if they hit exactly right. The Demons twist and turn so much that often two missiles don't hit the same spot and a Demon and as a result only damage it.
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Ah, they've changed that.

Well, try popping three missles.

BTW, can you ram the Demons with your Centurion in the remake?

Ramming lighter weight fighters with a Centurion was always a good way to kill one or two in a pinch in the original game.
 
JKeefe said:
Two missiles only kill a Demon if they hit exactly right. The Demons twist and turn so much that often two missiles don't hit the same spot and a Demon and as a result only damage it.
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Doublechecked my walk-through.

Two Heatseakers ... The lock only on the back of a Demon and if you pop it with your guns and fire two, they will always hit in the same sector.

Knew I was forgetting something.

If you are a good shot, one photon torpedo ...

Just as an fyi

Note:

Gun Range Speed Damage
Plasma 2856 840kps*** 7.2cm
Ionic 4080 1200kps** 5.4cm
¡Tachyon 4250 1250kps*** 3.7cm
¡Particle 3400 1000kps* 4.3cm
Neutron 3060 6.2cm
Meson 1300kps** 3.2cm
¡MassD 3740 1100kps* 2.6cm
Laser 4760 1400kps* 1.8cm

¡ before a gun means that the information in Player's Guide is incorrect. (Specifically, Tachyon does less damage by 1.3 cm, Ionic, Mass Driver and Particle Cannon recharge faster than book rates).​
 
Oof. I've been trying two plasma cannons on the inside, two tachs on the outside, and a full load-out of proton torpedoes. With that kind of heavy-hitting hardware, I can usually blow two or three demons away in a heart-beat. The problem is that the computer keeps having five Demons already waiting for me, when I come in off of auto-pilot. It's really annoying to arrive on the scene, only to see the Demons already tearing through two-thirds of the Drayman's shields. /Sometimes/ the computer has only three Demons wailing on the Drayman, but by the time I rip the first three apart, the next two or so are already in the mix. FRUSTRATING.

I will, of course, keep trying. I just wish there were ever some wingmen for hire at Oxford. Rotten luck, I'm telling ya. Thanks for the great advice, though, guys. I'll keep trying. I wish there was a mission counter, now, because I'm think I'm already at 40+ times running through this mission, trying to beat it in a Centurion... (And ramming only works /once/, with the Centurion's weak armor.)
 
Khavik said:
Oof. I've been trying two plasma cannons on the inside, two tachs on the outside, and a full load-out of proton torpedoes. With that kind of heavy-hitting hardware, I can usually blow two or three demons away in a heart-beat. The problem is that the computer keeps having five Demons already waiting for me, when I come in off of auto-pilot. It's really annoying to arrive on the scene, only to see the Demons already tearing through two-thirds of the Drayman's shields. /Sometimes/ the computer has only three Demons wailing on the Drayman, but by the time I rip the first three apart, the next two or so are already in the mix. FRUSTRATING.

I will, of course, keep trying. I just wish there were ever some wingmen for hire at Oxford. Rotten luck, I'm telling ya. Thanks for the great advice, though, guys. I'll keep trying. I wish there was a mission counter, now, because I'm think I'm already at 40+ times running through this mission, trying to beat it in a Centurion... (And ramming only works /once/, with the Centurion's weak armor.)
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That is a bug then, the Centurion's armor and mass should let you ram more than once.
 
Dire Wolf said:
That is a bug then, the Centurion's armor and mass should let you ram more than once.
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I don't recall exactly how ramming worked in the original, but in the VegaStrike engine, it seems somewhat random. Physics dictate that two colliding ships suffer EXACTLY the same amount of damage (measured in energy). I've often had my front shields completely killed plus damage to the armor, while an opponent in a smaller ship (e.g. a Demon) has only suffered partial shield damage. I might also have seen the opposite, but for some reason I tend to notice such things more when they are not going my way ;-)
 
fRuStRaTeD... (sigh)

Okay. 50+ times trying to beat the 3rd Oxford mission, and still no luck. I put the game on Very Easy mode. Still no go. I swapped out for a Galaxy, hoping the increased turret coverage would help. Still no go. (And that brings up a question... Why can the Galaxy only have a single 'on top' or Z+ turret? Why can't I get a rear turret, too?) I've swapped four plasma cannons for four tachyon cannons. I've swapped proton torpedoes for heat-seakers. (It takes, on average, six heat-seakers per Demon -- minimum of four.) I even tried edit-cheats, like maying the Drayman into a Paradigm, for crying out loud!

I can kill one, possible two Demons without any problem. But for some reason, the third or fourth Demons get really wiley and hard to kill. And by then, the Drayman dies. Guys -- I can't do this. 50+ times on the same mission, and I'm a little frustrated at my inability to beat it! So I ain't got the skills, or the smarts, to beat this mission, but... I'm beat! I /love/ this remake. I loved the original, too -- but /this/ isn't the original, on this mission. Holy cow. Some help, here?
 
Khavik said:
Okay. 50+ times trying to beat the 3rd Oxford mission, and still no luck.
...
I even tried edit-cheats, like maying the Drayman into a Paradigm, for crying out loud!
...
Holy cow. Some help, here?
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If you give up and just want to get past the mission, someone here posted a very effective solution: Reduce the Demon's max speed *drastically*. (that would be the units spreadsheet).

I put the game on Very Easy mode.
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IMHO, the mission is easier on harder levels. They run too much on easy.
 
Slowing the Deamons works in this mission, but when you get to Palan, you're toast. They will tear you apart no matter what.
I got tired of the Palan missions, because no matter what I did, the Demons would kill me, and make it even harder to complete the mission (see the thread about enemies remaining in the system after death).
So I finally took drastic measures and used a memory hacker to give me unlimited torpedoes. I used them as a chaingun, and it worked!
Of course, I turned it off after I had completed the mission. This is much easier than hacking the files everytime you get stuck - and the probability of success is probably better, too.
If all other fails, try this method. But you'll have to be a decent shot not to hit the drayman, or the mission will be over within seconds.
 
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