Tarawa's flight deck

Marc

Commodore
I'm on it, here's the ealy stuff... needs some stairs.
I'm really thinking of cutting those pilars... but I'll have to replace them with something else to create that "this ship was not desingned for this" look
 

Bandit LOAF

Long Live the Confederation!
Looking great, Marc.

Well to keep with Standoff's idea, could it be said that the later models of the Wake Island class had a rear launch bay installed precisely because of Bear's recommindations from the Tarawa?

As I said earlier, my understanding was that Standoff works the way it does because they're "replacing" the Cerberus, which recovers fighters from the rear... if they *can* have a single, forward bay they should certainly consider it.
 

PopsiclePete

Mission programmer
We could, but at this stage (and considering we want to release the next episode soon) I guess Eder would say that it's out of question. As I said in my earlier post, there is no engine-related technical limitation forcing us to recover the ships from the rear... but now that it's modeled, converted and that our mission code has ben adapted to it, it'd be lots of work to redo it with a closed back.
 

Sarty

Rear Admiral
Marc said:
I'm really thinking of cutting those pilars... but I'll have to replace them with something else to create that "this ship was not desingned for this" look

You could eliminate the pillars and add some kind of storage racks on the ceiling. That would make it seem more like a supply transport, especially considering that the Marine LC's were stored above all the fighters on some kind of storage racks in End Run.
 

Marc

Commodore
the stairs are there... crude but there, although it screws up the last two parking spot on the deck
And I've moved the pilars out of the way but... this just looks like some cheap StarWars Imperial landing bay 'a la Wing Commander.

ah boy. this one's an all nighter for shure.
 

Marc

Commodore
Sarty said:
You could eliminate the pillars and add some kind of storage racks on the ceiling. That would make it seem more like a supply transport, especially considering that the Marine LC's were stored above all the fighters on some kind of storage racks in End Run.

yeah, that's good stuff! ...if I remember correctly, there's a scene in WC2 on the flight deck where we see some sort of huge metal arm made of white metal, like a futuristic crane to load/unload supplies... ad that to the storage racks uptop and we've got ourselves one big-converted transport ship... later folks, gotta go.
 

Sarty

Rear Admiral
I think you should widen the back of the launch bay for 2 reasons.

1: there should be a dedicated "runway" area of the bay, with a launch catapult and all, narrower than where the fighters are stored. The way it is now, the first few rows of fighters get screwed when it comes time to launch.

2: upon Jason's arrival to the Tarawa he notices that the Ferret squadron is parked behind the Sabre squadron and he makes a mental note to have that changed. For that to happen, the area where the fighters are stored would have to be "sunken in" to the ship more.

So I think you should eliminate the rows parking spaces about half of the way back, making the runway narrow, then widening the back half to look more like a bay where the fighters are parked. I think that would look nice.
 

LeHah

212 Squadron - "The Old Man's Eyes And Ears"
Hey, that looks great!

I'm a little rusty to the Tarawa but some things occured to me while looking at your pictures.

1.) The Tarawa was a refitted ship - it had previously been a freighter. While you're definitely going for the "old" style - which looks great, again - you should consider making something look "off". Be it pylons or something else.

2.) What about crew bays in the side? It seems kinda sad that some people would have to run the length of the ship to get to their fighters. :(

I'm not sure if this is a technicality or what-have-you but the WCM Tiger's Claw (from generally the same pre-WCIII era as the Tarawa) also didn't have a rear launch bay. That could be attributed to any number of things though.
 

Bandit LOAF

Long Live the Confederation!
Looking great! Keep this up, please -- it'd be awesome to have a perfect Tarawa model.

Some thoughts:

* I'd straighten the Terran Confederation flag, as it was supposedly painted on (per the last part of End Run). Below it should go the roll of honor (list of those killed in action on the ship), and then to the right of that should be the ships commissioning pennant. (This is what Kevin gives Bear -- they're big long eel-shaped flags... you can GIS and find the American one.)

* There should be some safety nets at the end of the flight deck.

* I have many of the WC2 'scene' textures, if there are any you think would help with this project.
 
It looks good. Keep it up. :D

I agree with LOAF about it having a closed deck And Stary is right too about the fighters being boxed nose to tail instead of in a row.

Here are a few things that I've found that might help. Mostely with the armaments.

Class: Escort Carrier (CVE)
Length:
Mass:
Max Velocity: 247KPS ER p.78-79
Cruise Velocity: 100KPS ER p.78
Acceleration: Gilgamesh class engine system
Max Y/P/R:

Guns: 1 Heavy quad-barreled neutron gun mounted on bow (forward defense).
2 Medium caliber mass driver cannons on either side of the approach deck.
2 Two more beam weapons along the bottom ER p.68
Long range laser cannons ER p.189)
Neutron turret along the bottom. ER p. 290
3? several launch racks for missiles along the bottom
Anti torpedo missile mount on the bottom ER p.250 (forward facing)
2 Particle cannons firing port.
? Stern anti torpedo guns (mass driven shots) ER p.250

Front Shield: Phase Shields
Rear Shield: Phase Shields
Front Armor:
Rear Armor:
Right/Left Armor:
Fighter Complement: 42 craft
Jump Capable: Yes
Crew size: 500 personal

All armaments aboard Tarawa are stored in blast-proof lockers beneath the flight deck. ER p.167

Bridge was located near the topside of the ship just forward of the jump drives. ER p.75

Later modification after Strike Force Valkyrie take out a kilrathi minor orbital base six mass driver mini guns were welded to the ship just forward of the landing air lock for point defense.

Fire retardant nozzles in the bay ceiling p.92
Hooks in the ceiling. p.167
 

HammerHead

Rear Admiral
Tarawa flight deck

After playing Standoff I had the uncontrolable desire to re-read End-Run... so I did... and I had the same question - I was used to imagening the Tarawa as a fly-trough carrier - as she was depicted in Standoff...

And when I read the book, all the little things made me wonder...
* why combat launch is so problematic?
if you have only one catapult and it is an emergency, you can in addition to the catapult, have some fighters lunch from the back (by gliding out of the ship, like in regular launches).

* why when a fighter crashes on the deck it competly disturbs all landings?
simply land from the other side...

(and more points I forgot...:) )

I got it on page 260. during the funarel, all bodies are placed in a row in front of the bay. when the time comes to move the bodies out of the bay, and I qoute from the book -
"with the ship running stern first, as the bodies hit the atmosphere outside they tumble away into the green blue amonia soup sky and disappeared"
When you move the bodies out the bay, if the ship was flying forward, the bodies would have hit the atmosphere and be pushed back in to the bay - that is why the ship flying stern first (in reverse) so when the bodies hit the atmosphere they simply float away behind the ship.
and why not simple move them out the back bay?
simply - because there isn't one... because the Tarawa is not a fly through carrier...
 

Bandit LOAF

Long Live the Confederation!
Fighter complement should be 45... three squadrons of fifteen each: "There were only fourteen pilots left out of the forty-four that he had called pups only weeks before."

(Actually, that implies that the complement should be 47... 44 rookies + Bear, Doomsday and Starlight. I'm not sure how that'd divide up properly. Perhaps it's three squadrons of sixteen each and there's another veteran we don't hear about. Blair, per the TPoF novel, perhaps.)
 

Marc

Commodore
Bandit LOAF said:
I'd straighten the Terran Confederation flag, as it was supposedly painted on (per the last part of End Run). Below it should go the roll of honor (list of those killed in action on the ship), and then to the right of that should be the ships commissioning pennant. (This is what Kevin gives Bear -- they're big long eel-shaped flags... you can GIS and find the American one.

I've improvised something that could pass off as an eel on a flag, but I'm really gessing there. As for the American one- not a clue has to what you meant. But it's so small, it might as well be a can of green pees and still pass as an eel.

So this is where I'm at. I've put in some pretty basic storage rack uptop and added two cargo lift ( cause let's face it, some of these fighter are gonna have to get to different part of the hangar and not roll over each-other ).

At first I didn't whant to change the parking layout, but I always try before saying no- and dude, good call.
There's a catapult dawn in to the flor, along with safety nets that are supposed to come out of the deck (though there not mutch more than black lines)

Also, I've tone down the 'StarWars look' thing and it's growing on me :)
 

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Marc

Commodore
I'm double posting cause I have to work around the size limit :)
 

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HammerHead

Rear Admiral
you still need som taxing way - how will you move recently landed crafts to the back of the hanger? moving all craft around while circling them places all the time is somewhat impracticle...

I thing your original deck layout was more logical and practicle...
 

Marc

Commodore
Bandit LOAF said:
(You made one heck of an eel flag, though. With your permission, I'd like to make it my avatar.)

shure feel free. And that goes the same for eveyone else about anything I've ever posted- It's all free, not strings attached. If you whant it for anything, take it. Improve it. Make it your own. go nuts.
 

Marc

Commodore
now THAT makes sence to me! I'll admit, I felt ignorant about not picking up sooner, but its clearing up now.
 

criticalmass

Vice Admiral
I definitely like the feel of the hangar, but I've got one question: If I recall right, at one point in End Run, didn't they latch bombers to the roof of the hangar to have enough space for the additional wing? (Or am I mixing things up here? Can't check, book's in another country)

So I wonder about scale - is this hangar large enough to hang equipment to the ceiling and still move/man fighters directly below?


And:
Some more about pennants, really interesting read: http://www.history.navy.mil/faqs/faq106-1.htm

I really like the eel flag. I really do.
 
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